Physics 1st, Chemistry 2nd, Biology 3rd, but what maths before physics?...science majors please read..?

Question

My sister's in her first year of college. She tried to take biology, but on her 1st day, the teacher explained to the class that if they hadn't already taken chemistry, they would have a rough time in her biology class. My sister dropped the class a week later due to complete confusion. She then attempted chemistry, but also ended up dropping out of it within the 1st week since she never took chemistry or physics in high school; and doesn't even understand what an atom is! Yes, the school system has failed her, what to do now? I found that physics, since it's the basis for understanding the more abstract concepts introduced in chemistry and biology, would be the best starting point for her. But, physics (along with all sciences) requires lots of math. My sister's taking college algebra right now. My question is, what math courses/subjects are recommended to take/learn before taking a college physics course (assuming no prior chemistry or biology courses have been taken)? thanks

P.S. She's planning on majoring in biology.

P.P.S. Although i'm also interested in a degree in physics and biology, i'm not using my sister as a cover for a question that's really for me..lol She really is in this situation and I want to give her some sound advice

Answer 1

Being in the sciences (life or physical) you would most likely need to take 1 semester of calculus or pre-calculus. Probability and Statistics should be taken as an elective if it's not required. Physics requires a lot more math than chemistry. Don't get me wrong, chemistry does require math but in the undergraduate major it's not as big of an issue.

If your sister is just in introductory biology then there shouldn't be any math. If there is any math then it should be basic algebra. I would recommend that your sister talk to her advisor. It may be that this particular professor emphasizes a lot of math.

Answer 2

You really need calculus to do well in physics, I found. I don't agree with your train of thought on this subject. Physics should not be taken before Biology or Chemistry. I would suggest your sister take some sort of summer Biology and/or Chemistry classes, then retake those courses during the next semester. They really are the introductory classes, or foundation classes for the Biology degree. Without a strong foundation in these two courses, your sister will not make it as a Biology major. The classes only get more difficult and more involved as time goes on. Perhaps your sister is not meant to be a Biology major? I am not trying to be mean or discourage her/you in any way, but it is a very difficult major. Not only is the material difficult, but it is also time consuming. I had to put my social life on the backburner in college in order to do well in my studies. Not only are there classes, but there are also labs, about 4 hours a week. Science majors are generally in class about 8-12 hours more a week than their friends. How does your sister know that she wants to be a Biology major if she never took it in high school? Maybe she should take some classes in all different subjects and see if Biology is really what she wants. If it is, she going to have to put in A LOT of time and effort to accomplish her goals. Good luck to her.

Answer 3

Ugh, she doesn't sound like she is in a very good place for starting a biology major. Many colleges have seperate courses of physics for phys majors, other science majors, other majors. The first two may require calculus although in many places only the first does. Most colleges expect bio then chem then phys, so that kids have more math by the time they take phys, but others have set up the expected sequence differently. If she really doesn't have a good idea of atom vs molecule etc. she may be better off taking a chemistry course at a community college perhaps with some tutoring. That will be most set up for helping someone catch up a bit.
Like someone above said, she should probably talk to an advisor at her school because some schools have intentionally inverted the traditional bio->chem->phys sequence and have different expecations accordingly.
Best of luck to you both!

Answer 4

Your sister is in a pretty tough spot being in college without even knowing what an atom is, but if she wants to be a biology major, which is well-known for difficulty, she's going to have to be realistic and realize that she has alot of catching up to do.
Since she already dropped her sciences of biology and chemistry this semester, she should try reading the chemistry book on her own and seek the help of a tutor, things she should be able to do without being enrolled in the class. Biology and chemistry often go hand in hand, and while introductory chemistry is going to be important, it isn't absolutely vital for her to take it before an intro to biology. She should focus on her algebra and other core requirements this semester while brushing up on her chemistry and biology by reading the books, seeking some tutoring help, maybe even seeing if she can audit the class (sitting in on lectures without recieving a grade.)
That way, when next semester rolls around, she should be able to use her newfound algebra skills in chemistry, which involves some substantial math at times. Biology, while linked to chemistry, is mostly memorization and can be taken without doing chemistry first; if she does both at the same time she should be fine.
As far as physics is concerned, it is pretty abstract and math heavy, and won't help her much with biology, maybe a little with chemistry.

Answer 5

I majored in biology. I would say physics has nothing to do with chemistry or biology (really, could have done both without any physics). So forget that..

Having said this, its likely that you can understand biology without complicated chemistry as well. It looks to me that your sister simply lacks basic science. I am surprised that she hasn't taken any bio or chemistry at high school.. Perhaps the best thing to do would be to take the most basic biology and chemistry together If she can't cope with it, she should find a tutor for basic biochemistry and try and take the bio class again next term..

Answer 6

Mathematics is often called the "Queen of the sciences", and rightly so. My major is Chemical Engineering. But I sit right next to all the other scientists and engineers in math class. We all spen countless hours together in algebra, trig, calculus and so on. Sometimes I wish I could just take a pill and "know" all the math so I can relax and concentrate on the chemistry. I know some electronics engineers who spend up to 60 hours per week on math alone!

Answer 7

The route my University had we Biochem majors take was:
Year1 Q1:
Gen Chem
Math (for me this was pre-cal)
Q2: G chem
Calc 1
Intro bio (basic stuff called "diversity of life")
Q3: G Chem
Calc 2
Intro bio/ecology (still pretty basic)
Year 2 (here is where it got critical for me)
Q1: Organic Chem (need Gen chem for this)
Genetics
Q2: Biochem (must be taking/have taken 1 Q of Ochem)
O-Chem
Q3: Mol. Bio
O Chem

Year 3:
Q1 Physics
Dev& Cell bio
Q2: Physics
Physio
Q3: Physics
upper division specialty Bio class

Year 4: All upper division specialty Bio class

This schedule is pretty tight but it is all about getting your chemistry/math on track before moving to the "harder" biology classes. Some of the specialty classes did not require O-chem so my friends who were behind in chem took those instead of biochem/molecular series and went back and took the required biochem/molecular in their 4th(or 5th) year.

My biggest piece of advice is that she run- not walk- to her academic advisor who can help her get on a planned schedule (with room for error) and that she not allow anyone, even said advisor, to talk her out of the field she desires. It may take a lot of work and some extra time but she can do it!

Answer 8

In most places, including the two colleges I have degrees from, the order for Biology students is:
Chemistry, Intro Biology, Physics.
You don't need Physics or Bio to understand Chemistry.

Biology majors generally are expected to take Calculus based physics.
She needs to take Pre-Calculus and Calculus I before Calculus-based Physics I.
She needs to take Calculus II before Calc-based PhysicsII.
She needs to take pre-calc before calc I.

Biologists need more science than anyone else, because we intersect every science there is.

Colleges generally assume you've been introduced to science questions in high school. You need the sciences to study science. 90% of the science students in there know the stuff she does not, and that's bad. She needs to take the summer and get a High School chemistry review book before taking Chem, a bio review book before taking Bio and a Physics review book before taking Physics.

The review books for the New York State High School regents exams are good examples, and were even recommended at my school in Pennsylvania.

Your sister also needs to TALK TO HER ADVISOR at once. If she does not know who her advisor is, she needs to find out.

She also sounds like she had a substandard education, so she needs to see if her school has an EOP (Educational Opportunity Program) and even if she did not qualify for that program, she may benefit from the tutors most such programs offer.

Answer 9

She'll need a strong foundation in Algebra. Algebra II / Trig would be very helpful.
Some physics courses are calculus based, find out before enrolling by checking the course pre-requisites.

Biology in the upper level is going to require a knowledge of statistics.

Chemistry in the first year is going to require a knowledge of logarithms to calculate pH, pKa, pKb.

Answer 10

Tell her to seek out an advisor at the college. Biology and Algebra are normal courses for Freshmen.