Pitch count ....Why has it now become a concern in baseball ???

Question

I started following baseball in the 80's. Then starting pitchers did not worry about their pitch counts. Good Starting pitchers averaged between 20-30 complete games a year. Now, it is rare if a starter has more than 2 or 3 complete games a year. Back in the day, pitchers were encouraged to pitch more innings to build up arm strength and develope a "rubber" arm. See Nolan Ryan stats. Pitchers did not develope more arm injuries then they do now. If I was a MLB owner and was paying millions to a starting pitcher. I would expect more than 3 or 4 complete games a year...

Answer 1

I couldn't agree with you more. I date back to the 60's. I remember Ferguson Jenkins getting 20+ complete games most years. Pitchers routinely had 300+ innings. Now 250 is considered a workhorse. The five-man rotation has also played a big part in that. They used to have mostly four-man rotations. Most teams couldn't do that today. These poor rag arms couldn't handle the busy schedule.

Answer 2

I think you're misremembering a bit - there were only 3 pitchers in the 80s (Guidry in '83, Blyleven in '85 and Valenzuela in '86) who pitched at leat 20 complete games in a season, and none who pitched over 24. You are right, though, that the stat has gone down. I don't know that it's putting pitchers on pitch limits that accounts for it, though. Managers and coaches have been counting pitches for decades - it's only in the past decade or so that fans and broadcasters have paid attention to it.

I would suspect that, if you were able to go back and check, the number of pitches thrown per game, per pitcher now is probably the same as it was 20 years ago. There has been more of an emphasis on batters taking pitches and working the count, which results in more pitches being thrown to each batter. Averaging 4 pitches a batter will get you to that 120 pitches a lot sooner than 3.5 pitchers per batter will. 20 years ago, 120 or so pitches might get you a complete game, but nowadays you're lucky if it gets you to the 8th inning.

Combine that with managers who are more likely to pull a starter early (which can be traced in large part to Chuck Tanner and managers like him in the late '70s and 80s), and you've got pitchers throwing more per inning and managers who are more skittish about leaving a pitcher in too long. I'd blame those for the reduction in CGs more than I would blame the pitchers.

Answer 3

It's not that pitchers didn't develop as many arm injuries 20-some years ago as they do now. It's that there is so much money invested in any given pitcher that teams will shut down a pitcher if there is any question about the health of his arm. That's also why organizations are furious with pitchers, with any players, for that matter, who don't report problems.

Good starting pitchers may well have averaged 20 - 30 complete games a year, but most of them also burned out very, very quickly by doing that.

I agree with you, though, that pitch counts have taken the place of knowing your staff and of judgment.

Answer 4

The reason they have the pitch count is to protect their investment that they put into that player. Medicine has advanced since the 80's and it just so happens that it isn't good to have a "rubber arm" because that causes joint and tendon damage in the elbow. Most likely managers pull the starting pitches when they see a change in the velocity and delivery of pitch, which usually happens around 100 pitches. Also the emergence of the set-up man in the late 80s helped keep pitch counts down, and now most teams use 4-5 pitchers in a game to keep people fresh. As a MLB owner you do not want to hurt your multi million investment so most likely you wouldn't expect a complete game from your starting pitcher every time.

Answer 5

Up until the 80's, ball clubs carried four starters and two or three guys in the bull pen, that's why they had 20 and even a 30 game winner.In the 70's baseball began to evolve. Bullpens became more active. This is when, for example, guys like HOF Dennis Eckersly found that even though they could'nt go the distance any longer they could be of value coming out of the bullpen. Thus came the eveloution.Now ballclubs carry as many as15 pitchers on the roster as opposed to the old 7 or 8. And never forget my friend, Money talks! These guys today are a very valuable commodity And it is the managers job to protect the club's investment!!

Answer 6

it certainly relies upon on what you're valuable throwing for strikes. i assume, like maximum pitchers, your fastball is your maximum precise pitch. So, in case you like a strike, such as a 2-0 or 3-0 count quantity, you throw a fastball. even though, while you're valuable sufficient on your changeup, a 2-0 or a three-0 count quantity would be a great time to throw a changeup through fact the batter will assume a fastball. you will no longer decide to throw the comparable pitch each time you get a undeniable pitch count quantity. in case you throw a curveball each time a 2-one million count quantity comes up, the offense will p.c.. up on that and assume it. quite of questioning of what to throw in line with a count quantity, attempt to think of of what that batter has seen you throw and shop him off stability with the two what sort of pitch you throw and the place you throw it.

Answer 7

managers are all a bunch of babies and they dnt want to hurt thier pitchers arms managers back then would only have 2 or 3 pitchers so the had to through alot of complete games

Answer 8

Good question. I think the economics of the risk/reward plays into it. Also I think the new breed of players has produced better middle relievers for that very purpose. I know it's a big concern in youth baseball as it should be.

Answer 9

Because the more pitches you throw the more tired your arm gets.

Answer 10

It's allways been a concern.