If abortion is murder, then isn't a miscarriage unintentional manslaughter?

Question

I'm asking this one more time with a bit of clarity. Last time people argued one is intentional and the other is unintentional. Please note UNINTENTIONAL manslaughter as the criminal charge and its relation to that of INTENTIONAL murder. Each has different elements.
If you argue miscarriage isn't unintentional manslaughter because it is unintentional - you can't read.
We now have punishment for the crime of unintentional manslaughter. If you miscarry, you unintentionally disallowed the embryo/fetus to continue to birth.
If you want to go much deeper, one person said 60 to 80% of naturally conceived embryos are naturally flushed during menstruation. If that is okay - does only intent matter? If so, why is it okay to punish someone who was driving so carelessly that he or she could not stop in time to avoid UNINTENTIONALLY running someone over? If it is okay to punish him, then why is it not okay to punish someone who ate fish when pregnant and had a miscarriage?

Answer 1

first lets have a REAL definition of "unintentional" manslaughter:

Involuntary manslaughter, sometimes called criminally negligent homicide in the United States or culpable homicide in Scotland, occurs where there is no intention to kill or cause serious injury but death is due to recklessness or criminal negligence.

Notice the last 6 words!
"due to recklessness or criminal negligence."

So, if a person is pregnant and they do whatever they want, like snow skiing, water skiing, mountain biking or (insert any potentially risky behavior) and they have a miscarriage directly related to the risky behavior, such as: they fell down repeatedly while snow skiing or they kept falling off the water skis at a high rate of speed or they took several hard falls off of their bike, etc. Then I would think, yes they are liable and should be held liable for their actions. After all, it isn't just her potential child, it's the fathers as well.

However, this all depends on the point, "If abortion is murder."
Once a fetus develops to a certain stage, then legally, abortion is murder. But, until that point, the dividing cells are not considered a fetus or a human even. If left alone, the cells may or may not develop into a human and the womb may or may not spontaneously abort the fetus on its own.

tc

Answer 2

For one you will not miscarry from eating fish alone, there are a lot more issues that go along with a miscarriage. it is not murder or manslaughter to have a miscarriage. a miscarriage is when a womans body does not tolerate having the fetus inside her. she can not control what her body can handle and not handle therefore would not be unintentional manslaughter. a woman can not control when and if she will have a miscarriage, an abortion yes but a miscarriage. as for the driver not paying attention and runs over someone, that can be considered intentional or unintentional. if the person was on a phone and talking away then i consider it intentional because you shouldn't be on the phone and driving. if someone is having problems and is distracted by personal issues, it could be unintentional but it all depends on what the judge has to say. and everyone has their own opinion about whether a miscarriage is on purpose or an accident. you will get a different answer from everyone who decides to respond.

Answer 3

Religious people can't even figure out that even their own bible does not consider anything "alive" until it has taken breath and their entire religious based "it's murder" argument falls flat on it's face.

After God formed man in Genesis 2:7, He “breathed into his nostrils the breath of life and it was then that the man became a living being”. Although the man was fully formed by God in all respects, he was not a living being until after taking his first breath.

In Job 33:4, it states: “The spirit of God has made me, and the breath of the Almighty gives me life.”

Again, to quote Ezekiel 37:5&6, “Thus says the Lord God to these bones: Behold, I will cause breath to enter you, and you shall live. And I will lay sinews upon you, and will cause flesh to come upon you, and cover you with skin, and put breath in you, and you shall live; and you shall know that I am the Lord.”

In Exodus 21:22 it states that if a man causes a woman to have a miscarriage, he shall be fined; however, if the woman dies then he will be put to death. It should be apparent from this that the aborted fetus is not considered a living human being since the resulting punishment for the abortion is nothing more than a fine; it is not classified by the bible as a capital offense.

So no, it is not murder nor manslaughter.

Religious people really hate it when you can prove them wrong with their own rule book.

Answer 4

True, I guess.

By the same token, If someone murders a pregnant woman, they commit a double murder. I don't see what the difference is between that and the mother killing her own child. But saying a miscarriage is unintentional manslaughter I don't think is fair because it's not something that the woman has control over.

Answer 5

You're making a mountain out of a molehill here. There IS a big difference between accidently running over a jogger on the street and miscarrying the unborn. It's called control and random acts of god.

You're driving that car, you have control over the steering wheel and what direction that car takes. Even if you didn't see that jogger in time, you still have the ability to slam the brakes and slow down to lessen the injuries. You have even more control to get out of your car, check on the jogger, and call 911 to help him.

Some expecting mothers do everything they can to ensure a healthy pregnancy, and still miscarry for unknown reasons. They have little control over the fate of their unborn. They rely on prenatal care, faith, and hope. There are no natural control devices in a woman's body to stop a miscarriage in progress. If you think eating fish had anything to do with a miscarriage, I suggest you retake your health courses.

Edit:

The thumbs down I'm getting are not surprising to me. It seems unless I completely agree with the asker, I'm wrong. I refuse to go against my own ideals and say "Yeah, if anyone has a miscarriage it's their fault, and should be put in prison for it, those dirty-little-manslaughterers!" Well, I won't do it, ever, just to get a best answer. I will always give an honest answer, even if it's something you don't want to hear. So, carry on with the thumbs down. It's a personal triumph to know I didn't deviate.

Answer 6

I agree with I Hate Hippies. In order to charge someone with unintentional manslaughter, the person being charged must have performed some action that contributes to the death. A miscarriage is just something that happens physiologically to the fetus, that causes its death. I gotta hand it to you libs, though; every day you come up with some new, twisted type of (il)logic, trying to make those you disagree with look bad.

Answer 7

If a miscarriage is the result of someone abusing herself with drugs, alcohol, or engaging in risky behavior, then yes, it should be. But some women miscarry through no fault of their own.

Answer 8

Then wouldn't a heart attack be suicide?

Your argument makes no sense. In order to be manslaughter, even unintentional, you must be at fault in the person's death. In a miscarriage, the woman is not at fault in the fetuses death, even unintentionally.

Answer 9

I think your question is dumb and doesn't make sense. I also don't think there is an answer that will please you. Abortion is murder and an act of the person's will because they made the decision to end the life inside them, like premeditated murder. Miscarriage is not an act of the will and usually has a devastating effect on the woman.

Answer 10

No, it would be unintentional suicide since the miscarriage is a result of the fetus not doing what it is supposed to do, not the mother's fault. BTW - mothers of crack babies have been jailed for their use of crack.