The Holocaust?

Question

People say that the holocaust deniers are trying to revise history so that the state of Israel is artificial and illegitimate. But what I'd like to know is, what on earth could the holocaust have to do with the state of Israel. Zionism existed as a concept before Nazism, and long before Adolf Hitler. How does a genocide against a people give that people the right to steal the land of another people, slaughter them, torture them, and imprison them without trial?

Right, Moltar, there were Jews in Israel several thousand years ago. Funny thing is, there were also Hungarians in China less than two thousand years ago, and yet, if they tried to throw China out of their land and kill them when they protested, everyone would find that rather unfair. Oh, and anything that says donkeys can talk is not a legitimate source (The bible).

I don't have time to tell you the many obvious facts that point to Israel being the agressor in the conflict, so I'll just supply you with these videos:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HWBsB_ijNlc
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3vPMHJsgSTI

Yupchangee: Palestine did exist before the Jews moved there, most sane people have accepted this. And when it comes to early Arab-Jewish conflict in Israel, you should read what the early zionists wrote to give you any indication as to who was the aggressor. Do the Jews deserve a state? Possibly, but since everything but Antartica is pretty full and claimed, they are out of luck. Oh, and the Arabs did control it for a long period of time, the Turks took it from them in the middle ages, but Arabs still ruled at a regional level. Oh, and speaking of which, the ottomans conducted a census of Palestine before world-war one, and over 99% of it's population was Arab... Yeah, you can deny that there was a Palestine, but people deny that there was a holocaust too... Funny, most logical people still accept that both things existed. Most logical people also tend to accept that the Zionists are the aggressors in the Palestine conflict, need proof? See video links... But maybe you shouldn't click

on them, as a Palestinian hater, I'm sure facts don't matter too much to you...

Answer 1

I can say no more. you're totally right

Answer 2

Sure Zionism existed as a concept before Nazism,but the Holocaust was the event that made Jews think that they need a homeland...And Palestine was at the wrong time,under the wrong mandate...
Israelis think they are entitled to to steal the land of another people, slaughter them, torture them because they used to suffer during WW2,and now they think they have the right to make anything to stop something like the Holocaust happen again...unfortunately they don't realize(or don't want to) that they are doing exactly the same thing to the Palestinians...
As for the reason that Jews lived there 2000 years ago,I could not care less...Let's all leave our lands and give it back to the ones that lived thousand years ago there...The Arabs controled that territory for the last centuries and creating Israel there was a wrong move...And more zionists said that Palestine is their holly land because the Bible says so...Sure,let's listen to an old book,who's fact we have no idea if they are true or not...
I don't think that the Jews are entitled to a homeland,just because of the Holocaust...By this principle let's give the gypsies too a homeland,'cos they were victims of Holocauts too(a few millions of them dies back then)...Somewhere in India,'cos there is where they used to live thousand of years ago...It's wrong for a religion to have its own country...and more there is no place we could find to create a country for someone.One way or another they would have occupied someone's land...And probably the same thing would have happen...It was wrong to create Israel in Palestine,as it would be wrong to create it in another place...

Answer 3

The connection between the Holocaust and the modern state of Israel is this: By downgrading the Holocaust, Iran mobilizes supporters and paralyzes potential opponents. Its coupling of the last Holocaust with the one it signals daily it intends to carry out wins it support among the Nazis and the Sunnis alike. Its presentation of the Holocaust as a myth used to exploit Muslims wins its support in the international Left which increasingly views Israel as an illegitimate state. So by denying the Holocaust Iran raises its leadership profile both regionally and globally.
Even if the Left doesn't buy into Holocaust denial, it can still agree with Iran's conclusion that Israel has no right to exist. As Mottaki explained, "If during this [Holocaust denial conference] it is proved that the Holocaust was a historical reality, then what is the reason for the Muslim people of the region and the Palestinians having to pay the cost of the Nazis' crimes?"

Answer 4

Your claims are inaccurate. Nobody stole land from anyone.

Nobody slaughtered anyone, unless you refer to the Islamist suicide bombers who infiltrate into Israel and blow themselves up together with scores of Israeli civilians. Fortunately, Israel has an army to protect itself against these murderous Muslim terrorists.

The land never belonged to any "Palestinians," unless you use the term as it was used prior to 1948, when the Jews were called Palestinians.

Imagine the nerve of anyone to question whether the Jewish state has a right to exist! Have you asked whether the 22 Arab states have a right to exist? Whether the 60 Muslim states have aright to exist?

The Jews got the Mandate for Palestine set up for the express purpose of establishing the Jewish National Home, which would inexorably become, all parties realized, in time a Jewish state. It did not seem wrong then, and does not seem wrong now, that the Jews should have a state of their own. They asked only for the right to have no barriers put up to their immigration, and no barriers put in the way of their buying land. That was it. That was the sum total of what they demanded.

Until the 1948 war, when five Arab armies attacked, not a single acre of Arab-owned land (and remember that nearly 90% of the land, in any case, remained the possession of the state or the ruling authority, as in the Mandatory period) was appropriated. No one should dare to write about this subject without having done the research on demography, land ownership, and law.

"The fact is that today's Palestinians are immigrants from the surrounding nations! I grew up well knowing the history and origins of today's Palestinians as being from Yemen, Saudi Arabia, Morocco, Christians from Greece, Muslim Sherkas from Russia, Muslims from Bosnia, and the Jordanians next door. The civil and tribal wars between Yemenites (from Yemen) and Kessites (from Banu Kais of Saudi Arabia) ... are well known among Palestinians.

Answer 5

The one thing I love about people like this is there complete lack of historical perspective and there ability to critise and judge with impunity and then they fail to give a single piece of useful advice on how to fix the problem that they sight.

So whats the solution big guy?

Should all the Jews move out? If so where? Name me a group of nations that will take in six million Jews from Israel.

Should they stay? If so what are the borders going to be?

If you say 67 then how do you prevent another war like the three that happened before Israel took the west bank?

also what do you do with Muslim groups that say they will not stop fighting till Israel is gone. How do you deal with those?

exactly what I thought.

why dont you keep your trap shut until you can stop wining like a child and do something proactive to fix it.

Answer 6

So you are saying, that out of all the peoples in the world, only Jews do not deserve a state. In the 19th century, that land was very sparsly populated. there were always some small jewish comunities, particularly in Jerusalem & Hebron. There were also a few Arab nomads. Arabs didn't care about the land until Jews stareted moving there. Arab massacres against Jews goes bac to the early 20's, a quarter of a century befor Israel was a state.
Truth is, Arabs never owned that land. It was part of Turkey through the end of WW I when the Brits took over. I'm sure all this history doesn't matter to you because, as a bigot, facts aren't important to you.

Answer 7

The problem here is, we ARE talking about the same race of people, and there IS definitely a religious problem to be taken into consideration.

Bad things happened to the Jews. Bad things were happening to the Jews before the Holocaust, but the Holocaust was incredibly inhuman, and it is a scar on the conscience of man, and should be a reminder that unchecked, we as a species are capable of unspeakable atrocities. We should NEVER forget that.

Unfortunately, in order to rectify that horrific period of time, we have committed another tragic oversight. We put two groups of people on the same land who have vastly different ideologies and told them that the land belonged to both of them. Doesn't work. Hasn't worked. Won't work.

To make things worse, the land we put them on is "holy" to just about half the world. I don't think we could have planned for this to be worse.

As a Christian, I believe that there's going to be an end time, even if it doesn't star Kirk Cameron, and even if it's not exactly like everyone thinks it's going to be. Heck, the actors in the real one may even be able to pull off a decent line.

But the bible is pretty explicit in one thing. Everyone's going to hate "Israel" by the end of it. Now, a lot of my fellow Christians seem to think that if America (pretty much Israel's only supporter) turns its back on Israel, we're going to precipitate the End Times (even when they're saying it, they say it with Capital Letters). Thing is, that doesn't mean Israel won't deserve it.

If I were to move down the street into someone's house who paid for it and had been living there for years, I'd be thrown in prison. Even if my grandfather had owned that house many, many years ago.

But we "gave" Israel to the Jews, and the Jews are there. It just means violence and bloodshed, and in the end, I think we're going to stop supporting Israel in this conflict. Because they're going to deserve it.

Answer 8

After WW2, by the very open admission of Israeli Jews, the Zionists used the "guilt card" freely and openly as they kicked out the Brits and were recognized as a nation.

This guilt has been used to secure funding from various governments as well as private sources.

And, some Jews have tied disagreements over Israeli policies to being a Nazi, and will openly invoke the Holocaust.

Therefore, Iran et al believes that denying the Holocaust will undermine support for Israel. The current radical Islamists also trace their roots to leaders who were openly supportive of the Axis in WW2.


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As for motar's remarks....

The "Palestinians" are usually descendants of the Christians and Jews Bible times. Many converted to Islam in the 7th century, but these people are the ones that stayed after Rome destroyed the rebellion around 70 AD. They see no reason to leave places there their families have lived for thousands of years.

Answer 9

many there(middle east) say the only reason the Jews want to remember the holocaust is so they know how to treat the Palestinians. the other thing no ones talks about is through DNA we know the Palestinians are the lost tribe of Israel, they just stayed home and changed religion. weather Zionist like it are not, the Palestinians are the Jew who did not abandon Israel, they are the one who stay to protect her, it is their land even through Zionist ideas.

but on the other hand, did you ever hear of the American Indian

Answer 10

The Holocaust has been used as a way to guilt Western society into agreeing with the Zionists over their want of an Israeli state.

I've always wondered why the millions of Eastern European Christians who were forced into concentration camps have not received their own country as well.

Answer 11

Um, did you ever take a world history class?

Ever read the bible?

Well, Israel was there long before Palestine and it's their land.

Maybe if the Palestinians quit blowing up buses in Israel, they'd get better treatment in return.