Is pain useful to an organism without consciousness?

Question

Suppose a given organism with a nervous system were purely mechanical, having no consciousness. What then is the purpose of pain, if the stimuli do not inform a subject but simply cause a series of biomechanical functions?

Can all neuronal activity find an explanation on the basis of biological systems, such that pain for an animal may represent to the body how to respond to the environment without awareness of representation?

By 'pain' I mean 'the kind of subjective discomfort I feel' -- I agree that there are many simple creatures that appear to follow their instincts purely, are governed by rules, and do not require the subjective character of consciousness that I'm after. I readily agree that there are many unsensed and automatic processes our bodies initiate without our awareness... my question is whether or not the structures that do give rise to painful experiences in humans are exhausted in their functional description on the level of biology.

The question is vague, a better formulation might be: Are all the neuro-physiological systems necessary for our experience of pain functionally and exhaustively explained without reference to consciousness?

That is, what is the point of having awareness at all, if the body just responds rather deterministically to the environment?

Fair answers so far. I'll reply later if anyone remains interested.

I've clarified the motivations for this question. Of course consciousness is necessary for pain -- but can you biologically explain away what appears to produce pain (details about the nervous system) without reference to consciousness....

Biology plays a role but the question is philosophical in that ontological committment to conscious states seems to be requisite to a biological description of the nervous system. The qurestion is about inteliigibility and explanation and not about contingent factors that I could care less about.

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Answer 1

Define consciousness: 1. An alert cognitive state in which you are aware of yourself and your situation. 2. Having knowledge of.

Pain: A symptom of some physical hurt or disorder.

Philosophers need to be sure to accuratly and completely define things. We could not define your answer without first defining consciousness or pain. Ok...time for the answer...

Pain is the conscious intrepretation of stimuli. A processor (brain) must intrepret the stimulus as pain in order for something to be defined as being in pain. Therefore, pain cannot exist without consciousness.

If an organism does not have consciousness of pain, then the organism is not in pain.

But what degree of consciousness would have to exist before an organism could be described as being in pain? Does a dog act the same when it is sick? Does an amoeba not find food? Does an earth worm not react to flooded soil when it rains? We assume that these organisms are less conscious than a human. But as we can clearly see, they, in their own degree of consciousness, intrepret pain.

Let's look at this: you find that you had cut yourself on something, but you do not have any other consciousness of the matter. You notice that the cut is scabbing over. You did not experience pain consciously. Why then would the cut scab over. There was no pain because your brain was unable to process the stimuli, but you did start to heal. Your body then, without classified as being in pain, began to heal itself? Well, your body was conscious of the stimulus or nothing would have happened.

Something that cannot exist cannot be useful to any organism.

I see you added things up there...this is the philosopy section. We have to define things completly before we can answer anything. You cannot have pain without conscousness. Any other answer would be against the very nature of philosophy...unless someone else has proved me wrong on this matter (I hope not). :)

UPDATE: I appreciate that you updated your question. Now that I know that this is a biology question and not a philosophy question, go to http://www.howstuffworks.com there you can find out how the nervous system works. Sorry, but I don't have the energy to answer anymore of this question.

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UPDATE #2: Man, I am sorry, but your second update made no sense to me. I have no idea what you are asking for. Let's call my answer "good enough".

Answer 2

sounds like an argument to justify killing animals. I am with 100% of the way ;-) Your question is rather confusing on what you are asking. Are you saying consciousness seems pointless when it seems that we could survive on the nervous system responding to the outside world? whatever your asking it seems like your are simplifying the human existence. We are not just creatures thriving off biological urge a slave to the pain complex you seem to be focusing on. Their is a body and mind connection, but the two effect each other while being able to work independently. There are so many other things to consider to approach the understanding of why we humans are the way we are. It seems that one of the biggest difference between us and the animals in our self awareness. This self awareness is both a blessing and a curse.

Answer 3

Only humans are conscious. Other animals really have no need for it nor are complex enough to sustain it. Consciousness is an eternal mystery, but has something to do with the reaction between the different cortex's of the brain, which is a physical reality. When analyzing your own conscious, you feel a sense of memory, which you can tap into any second, yet is not always with you. Yet when you will it, you can dive into it, even having the ability to get lost in it. That large and vast memory is only computable in the most advanced mammalian brains. You also feel a sense of willpower, which is the essential part of you that makes you you and makes you go. You feel as though you can sift though information and logic in your brain, as well as emotions to make a choice. You of course have control over your body and the ability to use reason and logic. That is all controlled by different sections of your brain. You also have emotions, feelings and senses. Lastly, you have one of the very most important pieces of the puzzle: Language. Language governs how we think a lot. We have inner monologues, sometimes think through and with a language. And we use it to Communicate with other humans. Language is so important to the human species prosperity that many scientists believe that is one of the soul reasons why humans need or developed a consciousness. In language, you must use a subject, a verb or an object in combination. Caveman:"You pick berry." Cavewoman: "me want meat. No berry." Caveman: "Me want berry. You want meat. Me meat if you berry." Cavewoman: "yes, me berry, you meat." In this made up english translation of early cavetalk, which was very basic, they had to have a subject and object. It had to have a "Me" and a "You" and a concept of self, in order to communicate. This ability may of been the fruit to which consciousness evolved or was created.

Answer 4

The manifestation we call pain is a direct result of the lack of consciousness regarding the vast majority of human bodily functions. The so called usefulness of pain is really an assumption based on human ignorance about the real functions of the physical body or its original design. Those that wish to subscribe to their own peril may do so w/out attempting however to drag along the rest of us.

Answer 5

i can't go into the biology of it but it seems logical to assume the pain can direct the body away even if it lacks consciousness. worms and such with simple nerve systems react to pressure and chemicals and light, to move towards food and such but have no consciousness. also a program for a robot wouldn't be too complicated to tell it to randomly move untill it is out of a situation.

Answer 6

The purpose of pain is to provide negative stimuli to prevent damage to the organism in question. The issue is whether or not this negative stimulus will have any effect on an organism without consciousness, and I believe that it will. (With nothing to really back me up on that.)

Answer 7

Romans 1-19/20, states that all things from creation have been shown all there is to know of God even unto the eternal power and Godhead. All things have consciousness,just more limited in their awareness. All things are but God expressing his vision of himself. "God dwells within you as you".