Atheists: How do you explain 'elegance' in the universe?

Question

Scientists are always telling us how 'elegant' so many natural systems are. How is that possible in a universe based in Chance? Shouldn't at least half of the systems be 'ugly', and barely work?

This is even more true for natural law. HOW???

Drat. This q was intended for the R&S Section. Sorry for the inconvenience.

Jason - Good reply. But what makes you think God considers leftovers as mistakes? Multiple universes would provide an ideal source of limitless energy. Many consider this as the source of 'zero point' energy.

Answer 1

There are a few reasons for this unusual elegance.

First it is the nature of science. Our universe is more elegant than chaotic because it is governed by laws. Science says that things tend to go along the simplest route, so our universe will fallow laws. This is really fabulous because it allows for a great deal of variety while allowing us to predict some things. If our universe was totally chaotic humans would not survive in it because we need a reliable universe.

Second we concentrate on the elegant pretty things because, well they are elegant and pretty. There are tons of things with no images taken of them or with "boring" images. I admit, I give a lot of speechs on astronomy topics and from time to time I'll sneak in a pretty nebula for some visual stimulation.

Third, well, you seem to be hinting that elegance is something made. That might be true but remember that the universe is so overwhelming to us that we have to misuse words frequently. Our universe is overwhelming... simplified, it is elegant. That doesn't nessisarily mean that some asthetically minded being had to create it; it just means that being human, that is what we see in it.

Answer 2

There is not a human mind on the planet that can imagine all possibilites if radiation, nitrogen, all levels of chemicals in the atmosphere and in the universe were changed to some degree through billions of years. Like others said, if it doesn't work it stops existing after a while. We've only scratched the surface of the universe, the only human-made craft to leave the solar system are the voyager probes launched in 1970.

Answer 3

It's theorized and quite possible that there are an infinite number of universes, each with different laws of physics. If this is the case, we're lucky enough to live in one of the few universes where galaxies and stars and 'elegance' are possible. That 'chance' is chance indeed, 1 in billions, most of the others couldn't produce lifeforms that grow to ponder thier existance.

If there are miltiple universes with different laws of physics and therefore no 'elegance', how do you explain a god who makes so many mistakes?

Edit in response to your response: So a god created infinite 'unelegant' universes so that we could keep our light bulbs powered for an eternity? My knowledge of zero-point energy is very limited, but I've never seen it referred to in parallel universe theories, only in terms of harnessing it within our own universe. But again, I know very little about zero-point, so I'll finish with this: If you're saying there are other 'unelegant' systems out there, even if we can benefit from them, doesn't that contradict your original question and imply there is no god, that it all is just chance?

Answer 4

The obvious answer is those so called ugly systems eventually collapse on themselves, just as what happens with natural selection. The most effective systems continue. And for most of us that don't believe in "God" doesn't automatically mean that the universe is based on chance, just an ordered physical system with rules, some of which we have not yet discovered.

Answer 5

I'm not an atheist. But I'll put it this way from the point of view of science. The elegance you assumed in the question is true but still arguable. The laws of nature gives rise to that elegance of the universe. It may be the natural consequence of it and it gives rise to a great orderliness (decrease in entropy) to create beings like you and me at the expense of orderliness outside us (increase in entropy).

The presumed elegance of the universe is not the will of a conscious entity, but the physical laws of nature are the root cause of it.

Answer 6

The beauty of distance things. What can be seen.
A universe based in chance has the chance.
Who is the one says the system is "ugly"? or nice.
I do not know any scientist who are ALWAYS telling us how 'elegant' so many natural systems are.
Science is about pure objectivity.
We are part of universe and we do not always take chances if you know what I mean.

Answer 7

Elegance and ugliness are entirely relative. Just because we as humans believe something is "elegant" or "ugly" does not meant it so. One of the failings of theologians is their inability to remove themselves from a human reference point. The universe does not know what is "elegant" or "ugly" it simply exists for it's own sake whether intelligent beings are present to appreciate it or not.

Answer 8

The subjective breeds obsession. The objective breeds passion. The obsessed believe that they have a monopoly on beauty and grace and goodness and ironically believe that others who do not follow their dogma are blind without the dogma. The passionate enjoy the real beauty of the real mystery of the Universe. Here's a most elegant photo that we have recently taken of the beginning of the Universe:
http://www.princeton.edu/pr/pwb/03/0217

Answer 9

Effeciency. Natural selection favors adaptations that work in the simplest form with the least expenditure of energy. Therefore sucessfully evolved systems are elegantly effecient.

Answer 10

Order always results from chaos. In as much as I was not around to see how everything came into being (and neither were you),I say, "I don't know ..... YET!" To assume that some god, my less than intellectual ancestors made up, instantaneously farted the universe into being, is absurd