Is homosexuality a perversion?

Question

Gay rights activists often turn to the fact that "gays don't CHOOSE to be that way" to justify homosexuality. By that standard, isn't pedophilia a normal, healthy thing for those who are born that way, as long as the people with whom they are "interacting" consent? I never heard of a pedophile who chose to be that way, either - that doesn't make it okay.

Convince me otherwise; no insults please.

I agree with some of the users who have said that since homosexual activity is between two consenting adults, it is not, from a legal standpoint, the same as pedophilic activity since we live in a society where you have to be 18 or older to give real "consent." That is why I am against anti-sodomy laws. However, try to look beyond the pillars of our own society - what about pure, irrefutable moral values, regardless of culture or the laws that that culture might entail: what is the difference between a man having sex with another man who agrees, and a man having sex with a young boy who agrees?

You've got to think about this before you just call me a hatemonger; I DON'T HATE GAYS. That is an EASY way for you to ESCAPE intellectual debate. I'm being as civilized as I POSSIBLY CAN.

Some users have been quoting Bible scriptures to advance their argument. Please do not do this. I am a Christian myself, but anyone who chooses to believe otherwise is entitled to that position. This is an intellectual debate, not a spiritual one. This goes back to why I'm against anti-sodomy laws: I believe gays, because they are consenting adults, have the right to do whatever they want with eachother in their own homes. It is when they start trying to implement their values into the GOVERNMENT via gay marriage that I put my foot down. And as for those that say gays CHOOSE to be that way: grow up. I'm not gay, but I am certainly intelligent enough, and compassionate enough, to understand that nobody chooses to be that way. Whether they are BORN that way or not is irrelevant; the fact is, it is not a CHOICE. Now, please continue.

To the person who says pedophilic relationships do not involve "real love," or what by most definitions would be a form of true intimacy, look no further than the case in which a female teacher had sex with a younger male student, and later MARRIED HIM. Your argument falls apart.

And by the way, I never equated gays to pedophiles. I've already said a billion times you have the RIGHT to do eachother in your own homes, and pedophiles do NOT, so that right there destroys your accusation. I suggest all of you visit www.nambla.org for further research before answering this question if you haven't already.

I want all my opponents to stop saying "most people who molest children are straight males." That is utter RUBBISH. The idea that child-molesters are predominately straight is just as ridiculous as the idea that child-molesters are predominately GAY. They are THREE, DIFFERENT ORIENTATIONS. If you like women, you are straight; if you like the same sex, you are gay; if you like children, YOU ARE A PEDOPHILE. I never said GAYS were PEDOPHILES. Stop putting words in my mouth!

Answer 1

The difference is the definition of harm. A consenting *adult* is considered to be aware of what he's consenting to, and is considered emotionally capable of dealing with the intricacies and consequences.

A child is not considered capable of those attributes, and thus is not considered capable of offering true consent. There is too much risk of harm, especially mentally, and too much risk of coercion (the child saying 'yes' because they feel they have to, not because they actually want to.)

It is true that the age at which we consider someone a 'child' in this sense is somewhat arbitrary. Where you live, it is apparently 18. Where I live, the age of consent is 14 (with some caveats, most of which are meant to exclude coercive elements.) This is because the people who wrote the laws had different ideas of when the above considerations I mentioned held true, and when they were not true.

Also, for those who say "God does not make people gay," I present to you Romans, chapter 1 vs 26-27

"For this reason GOD GAVE THEM OVER to degrading passions; for their women exchanged the natural function for that which is unnatural,
and in the same way also the men abandoned the natural function of the woman and burned in their desire toward one another, men with men committing indecent acts and receiving in their own persons the due penalty of their error."

Quite clearly claims that God made at least these people gay...

Answer 2

First off, to the person who said it is a mental disorder, it is not. It's no longer listed as a disorder in the DSm and hasn't been for some years now. And find me a heterosexual who hasn't had a messed up upbringing also?

"doesn't feel like a choice to the gay person as they are seeking a bond of the same sex parent that for some reason does not occur and as puberty arrives that seeking of a bond turns to an attraction (natural lust) for the same sex where a bond was never made.' Wow, that is some false messed up Freudian logic which as one should know most of Frued's thories can not be proven. In fact I cam prove you wrong. I've always been tightly bonded with females but I never ever had a close bond or a positive role model in a male. And I am a lesbian.

Back to the original question... You ask for no insults yet you insult us by comparing us to PEDOPHILES! I don't even understand how you make this argument. Pedophilia does not involve real love. It is most definitely a perversion as we would all agree. On the other hand homosexuals have true love and love each other the way that heterosexuals do. There really is no difference between homosexual and heterosexual love, except the genders involved. They shouldn't be treated any different. And personally when I do get in a loving relationship I want to have a baby too. And I will raise my child with love. Because I am a lesbian, NOT a PEDOPHILE!

Edited to say: By the way, I'm a devout Christian and I know I am gay because God made me this way and if he was against it then he never would have made this way.

Answer 3

First of all the first respondent is not fully informed as many same sex relationships begin early in life just as many heterosexual relationships do.
To answer your question I rely on information gleaned from two excellent videos by gays that can be purchased from the Focus on the Family website called I Do Exist and Love Won Out. 1. There is no scientific genesis for an x or y chromosome to make being "gay" a birth matter. 2. It doesn't feel like a choice to the gay person as they are seeking a bond of the same sex parent that for some reason does not occur and as puberty arrives that seeking of a bond turns to an attraction (natural lust) for the same sex where a bond was never made. The two videos clarify it so well, that it is worth the small suggested donation and was so enlightening to me that I actually have found a new appreciation for why homosexuals look at Christians as hatemongers, homophobics extremus, and hypocritical. They are two videos that every person, gay and non-gay alike should view and they are not long in viewing, but quite informative for both parties. Your analogy with pedophilia is quite appropriate as it also relates to parental bonding. That is why it is so important when we choose to have children that we realize what we are truly choosing to do. And if we are surprised to find ourselves with child and unready, then give that child to someone who is ready, but don't just kill it.

Answer 4

Pedophilia as in the DESIRE to have sex with children is not a crime-it is the act that is a crime. Now, you can make the arguement that the act of homosexual activity is what's not okay. The difference is that a pretty sizable arguement can be made to say the acts of a pedophile are something very bad, whereas the acts of two consenting homosexual adults are not. I've never heard an even relatively convincing arguement of the latter case.

In short: there's a cost/benefits analysis that can be put on both activities (homosexuality and sex with children, who can't give consent). Pedophila has an extremely high cost, whereas homosexuality's main cost is that those who are convinced it's wrong feel oogy boogey about it.

Answer 5

You said "what about pure, irrefutable moral values, regardless of culture or the laws that that culture might entail". Who's morals? Irrefutable by whom? What makes them pure? You are using your own beliefs as a standard to judge all others by.
As for your original question, which by my interpretation is about pedophilia, I believe the point we are trying to make in society when we punish pedophiles is that they are harming someone that is not psychologically mature enough to make sexual decisions. If someone preys on a child, and sexually exploits them in any way, they have harmed another human being. IF the child consents they are not held responsible for their decision by our justice system because they are children. Just because someone like a pedophile feels the urge to do something harmful doesn't give them the right to do it. Sometimes I have the urge to break the law too, but I don't. Loving someone of the same sex is not harming anyone. There is a very big difference here. To make it simpler: if someone is mad at someone else and feels a natural urge to hit them it is not acceptable to do so just because it's a natural urge. If someone is naturally attracted to and/or loves another person that society says they are not supposed to love, that doesn't mean that it's a perversion or immoral.That my friend, is a matter of opinion, not fact.

I had to add to my original comment, I have a point to make. You asked if homosexuality was a perversion. A perversion is a misdirection of instinct. Homosexuals follow their natural sexual instinct, therefore, they are not misdirected. I guess by definition if I forced myself to have sex with someone of the opposite sex I would have misdirected my natural instinct and would be perverted.

Answer 6

QUOTE: I believe gays, because they are consenting adults, have the right to do whatever they want with eachother in their own homes. It is when they start trying to implement their values into the GOVERNMENT via gay marriage that I put my foot down.

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As far as this goes, you're effectively correct. But in a purely legal sense, shouldn't the same thing apply for straight marriage as well? Effectively it boils down to seperation of church and state. Because marriage is a religious institution, the government has no more of a right to say that heterosexuals can or cannot marry.

However, because many benefits are given by the government for marriage (committed relationships essentially), the same rights should be extended to homosexual couples. This is called equal protection under the law.

Each church should be allowed to marry whomever their respective deity allows. Now this marriage should have no bearing on any rights given to people by the law (again, seperation of church and state).

Thusly, the government should give equal benefits to anyone in a marriage or equivalent relationship.

Make sense? if you've got more questions, hit me up.

Answer 7

No, homosexuality is not a perversion. Your "comparison" of homosexuality with pedophilia has one glaring error, the gender of the child.
While you claim that pedophilia isn't a "choice" it IS a fixation on a particular age range which would fall under the category of a Fetish. Whether the pedophile in question is attracted to a child of either the opposite sex or the same sex as themselves(meaning the person's ORIENTATION would be something of a consideration and therefore not a "choice") their fixation upon the age of the (ahem) "object of their desire" would clearly place the sexual attention into the category of a paraphilia, a sexual psychic disorder.

A child simply does not have the cognitive ability to understand the complete ramifications of a sexual relationship and therefore no legal way to actually claim any form of consent. Your example of Mary Kay Letourneau is one example, not a complete list of hundreds or thousands of examples, and therefore is not valid as "proof", it is what's called an anomaly.


There are only 2 orientations, homosexual and heterosexual. Bisexuality is seen as being a combination of the two and not a "true" orientation into and of itself.

Answer 8

Gay people and pedophilia are not linked. Why? Homosexuals are not the ones that are doing this to children. Say what you will it is always, always straight males that do this and people think that just because I love my wife I have to love a kid too. NO.. It does not work that way. What once was common.. In history 12 yr old often wed old men is now not the normal. Good I am happy about that. I can say as a gay woman that I have never never felt the need for a child.. Because I am not sick. It is not perversion it is nature. After 6 billion people in this world just think of where we would be if we all had children. There is little room as it is. We are mother natures form of birth control

Answer 9

The definition of perversion is: a concept describing those types of human behavior that are perceived to be a serious deviation from what is considered to be orthodox or the norm. So if you want to say 660 million people (10% of world population) can't be considered as part of the norm, then you could call it that. But since the word has negative connotations why would you want to apply it to fellow human beings? Technically you might fit the description of Dickh**d. So is it offensive to describe you as such since that is what you are in the purest sense of the word?

Answer 10

Pedophilia is not okay, because even if the minor consents, their brains are not developed enough to make decisions like that. What pedophiles really need is help.

Homosexuality is NOT a choice. It has a biological (but NOT genetic) basis. Let me ask you a question that was posed to someone on a show called 30 days.

Pretend the bible no longer said that men must sleep with women, that that is a perversion and the way to go is to sleep with the same gender.

Could YOU change?