How come a play isn't dead when a football is hiked to a holder?

Question

Answer this smartypants . . . in college football, if you hold the football and one of your knees hits the ground the play is dead, right? Even if no one touches you, the play is over. So if a quarterback is hiked the football and runs back and trips and his knee hits the ground, play over. If that's the rule, then how come when you kick an extra point or field goal you hike it to a guy with his knee on the ground. The play should be over, right? If not, show me the rule, because I don't think there is one.

Answer 1

Under Rule 4-1/Ball in Play, Dead Bal, it talks about when the play should be called dead. Under Article 3B, it says:

"(Exception: The ball remains alive when an offensive player has simulated a kick or is in position to kick the ball held for a place kick by a teammate. The ball may be kicked, passed or advanced by rule)"

So, I guess it's officially covered. I found it on page 75 of the official NCAA football rules:

http://www.ncaa.org/library/rules/2005/2005_football_rules.pdf

Answer 2

No, the ball in that case isn't dead until it crosses the plane of the goal line after being legally kicked or until it is dead in player possesion in the field of play or an end zone or out of bounds due to a muff, fumble, incomplete pass, or tackle. Besides, who said the holder's knee HAD to touch the ground? I've seen fake field goals run where the holder merely squatted down and took the snap then got up and proceeded to pass the ball or carry it himself, or pitch it to an end on a reverse, or to the kicker to do something with it. The play isn't dead in the instance of a kicking play until one of the aforementioned conditions is met. The rules have been amended over the years to afford the holder similiar protection as the kicker in the event he fumbles the snap and becomes a runner or passer instead of a holder. The holder has to start in a down position similar to an O-lineman, which makes him elligible to "pick up" the snap from center and do whatever can be done, for a shotgun or long snap by rule is a fumble in flight, therefore, he's merely controlling a fumble to be set for a legal play.

Answer 3

Actually if a player is in a set position then he can be down. If he is moving and touches the ground the play is over. When the player kneels down to take the hold for the field goal or extra point he is in a set position, so the play is still alive if he were to get up and then set down to hold the ball the play would be dead. Side note it is a good question.

Answer 4

There is a rule that says if a player starts the play with his knee down, he can receive the ball and not be down. It is a rule specifically designed for holders for the kick or a fake field goal. And they figure no one would ever find a good way to exploit this rule.

Answer 5

I have been educated today. I always wondered why MSU's fake field goal against ND a couple years ago counted because the holder still had his knee on the ground. It isn't a matter of already being on the ground, or receivers would get off their knees and run after catches. It's the exception to the knee down rule. A holder gets to get up even on a fake and run, pass, or kick.

Answer 6

Sounds like a special play covered by the rules (rules of the extra point/field goal)

http://www.ncaa.org/library/rules/2006/2006_football_rules.pdf

Answer 7

because the play starts with that player in a down position. They have to start in a down position
SMARTY PANTS !