Was the Judge right to ask the Muslim lawyer to remove her veil yesterday?

Question

He said he could not hear her. Is she within her rights to demand that she be allowed to continue

Answer 1

If the judge couldn't hear her clearly then I think he has every right to ask for the person in question to remove her veil. If the woman who is a lawyer could not be understood in court then she is not doing her job properly due to the presence of her veil and the judge could not do his job properly either. I can only respect for asking for the veil to be removed, I mean it isn't for very long and she was fighting for someone in court!

We're in Britain here where the covering your face is seen as suspicious, these women relly need to think about the message the veil puts across about them and their religion.

Answer 2

I'm not familiar with the case, but it would seem to me that the judge is within his rights here. He could just as easily tell a lawyer to put on "more" clothing if he found somebody's miniskirt offensive because it was too revealing. A judge determines what is appropriate dress and what is inappropriate dress in his/her own courtroom.

In England, for example, I think the lawyers still wear "formal" robes and wigs! That is considered "appropriate" legal attire for their judicial system; dressing otherwise is considered "contempt of court".

The judge, in this case, is not asking her to remove her dress. That WOULD be inappropriate. Muslim women in countries like Saudi Arabia and Iran and Iraq (supposedly "notoriously" suppressive against women) routinely show their faces in public; just not anything else. There is no reason the trial lawyer "can't" remove a veil when she is arguing a case.

Answer 3

The judge was right. The need to know who we are dealing with is integral to European culture: this includes the Law, Business, Education, Medicine, Finance - every aspect of public life. It's also the basis of public life in most countries of the world.

Any person who does not want to live a public life is not compelled to do so. She can stay concealed at home if that is her choice. But if she wants people to engage with her, she must reciprocate. If she's not happy with this, she could consider emigrating to a country - such as Saudi Arabia - where her veil would be accepted.

Of course, she would not be able to drive a car there, and the areas of law open to her would be strictly limited. Indeed, her life would be far more restricted than the freedom she currently enjoys in the UK. So she's holding this piece of cake in her hand. She wants to eat it, but still to have it too. Can't be done sister !

I have the impression that all this veil business embarrasses most Muslims in the UK. They don't like to say anything much about it, we all try to be loyal to those we see as "our" people, but I suspect most normal Muslims are quite fed up with these young women.

Answer 4

Yes, he was right.

I don't like the wearing of veils but I don't think they should be banned.

There are however circumstances when I think people are fully within their rights to demand that it should not be worn. These include circumstances where non-verbal communication is important - such as in a classroom or courts and at other times to check a persons identity.

Let people wear a veil if they must but if it restricts their opportunities - it was their choice and they do not really have any grounds for complaint.

Answer 5

Yes, if it truly was because he could not hear her.

The fact that the lawyer then turned up on day 2 and still refused to remove the veil, to me, is terrible: as a lawyer your job is to represent the best interests of your client, not to push a political and cultural agenda of your own. If she did not want to do as the judge asked she should have booked Counsel for the hearing or got one of her colleagues to do it for her.

Not clear from the news reports what kind of "lawyer" she is - if she's a solicitor, then she should be disciplined by the Law Society in my opinion.

Answer 6

Yes. The issue is similar to that of the student who refused to remove her veil briefly so the bus driver could compare her face with her pass photo: one is entitled to confirm the identity of a person claiming a right. In this case, the "right of audience" of a barrister in court.

But, with someone arguing in court it's even more vital: if there is a transcription being made, the recording machine and the stenographer won't be able to transcribe properly. And stenographers also may need to lip-read.

As for the judge, s/he is accustomed to giving testimony and argument varying levels of weight and credence depending upon the demeanour of the person standing before the bench.

If the Muslim lawyer doesn't like that, then she should do what veiled Muslim women do in the country her ancestors (or if she's a convert, those of her co-religious) came from: stay home, or at leat stay out of the professions.

I wouldn't go to a veiled doctor, either.

She is being a political activist, making a cultural statement and not obeying a mandatory rule of her religion. We all know that. We need not tolerate abuse and contempt from her.

Answer 7

I am not racist and i think covering their face is their own choice in most circumstances .Saying that it is not appropriate in certain professions and in a court is one of them if the defendant wore a hat in court he would be told to remove it All lawyers and solicitors have a dress code they have to follow in court, you will not see a lawyer or barrister in court wearing jeans and a tee shirt
they are their to represent their client their clients not them self if they want to cover their face OK but its up to them to choose a profession where it`s acceptable.

Answer 8

Yes he is right. It is his court and what he says goes. The veil has no religous meaning, it is just a fashion. Lawyers exist on good communication, if that is compromised by either not being able to see their facial expressions or not hearing them, they are not serving the cause of justice one little bit.

Answer 9

I am not anti muslim or any race but if we went to a mainly muslim country we would have to respect their culture or get out. People who come to britain should be aware that it is a christian country and respect our cultures. A lot of the asian community chose to live in our country so they should respect out believes as we would if we went to a muslim country how would muslims feel if we ate bacon sandwhiches in there country they would find it offensive why should they take offense to respecting the british way of life. I have many asian friends of all beliefs and respect that but when they try to push there beliefs on us its wrong was there a simular thing with adlof hitler and the jews he didnt like what they stood for so he attact them they dont like the britsh way of life they should choose another country to live in.

Answer 10

I believe that the veil is a sign of a woman who belaieves she is a submissive inferior person. If she is not at good as any man, what is she doing in court representing anyone? We, all western nations, are a visual people, we look at the face and body language to decide if a person is telling us the truth, how can we decide if this lawyer is trying to blow smoke up our _______or what.