Does anyone in a city actually NEED a 4 by 4 to drive around in?

Question

I live in London. I see 4 by 4 cars all the time. They block the streets and traffic lanes. They have, I believe, more chance of killing someone if they hit them than a normal car.

I will not rant about what the drivers are like or what I have seen them doing (though isn't using a mobile phone whilst driving illegal in this country?) I simply ask the question above.

Actually StingRay I did feel the need to ask this question. Hence I did it. Next time you feel the need to stick an oar in be my guest that is what this site is about. But if all you can add is insult and vague critisim stick to the children asking for help with their homework.

No. Actually don't.

They need the right answers. :)

I apologise if my question upset some people who do in fact need a 4 by 4 to drive to work in. My question was prompted by the fact that the 4 by 4's I see in my local area (where there are no floods at the moment, there is no ice and no muddy ground) seem to be status symbols rather than have any practical purpose. I am pleased to see that some people have actually said that Yes they do need such a car. As someone else said in answer to my question though, there is a difference between need and want.

Oh, and another thing Stongray (ooh he got in my craw :) ). Sometimes asking a question is a means of getting people to question for themselves and as a consequence may in fact have the result of causing a change.

saljegi - I believe you are the first person to mention banning? I would hope that people don't need to be banned from anything. I would hope that they would see that their desires are not their needs (as has been mentioned by someone else below) and take responsibility for what they buy. Sometimes our desires are turned into needs by our fears too.

Ray P - My mistake. All the big cars I have seen are 4 by 4's as far as I know.

I don't drive, I have no interest in cars. I use public transport. Or I walk. Since you are in Cumbria and perhaps a little isolated perhaps you do need a 4 by 4. But I stress again the 'need'. Cars are boxes that move and get you from a to b. Some need to be tougher than others, some need to go longer distances than others on less petrol. But I keep using that word need. If you want a car that goes 150 mph when the laws in this country restrict you to a max speed limit of 70mph that sounds like desire. And when would you use it? When you want a big car 'because you like it' or 'it looks good' then you don't need it. And if you attitude is "Stuff you I can use what I want!" You strike me as being very selfish.

Answer 1

In a word "No!"

In many words:

It is ironic that there is an arms race of cars to make people 'feel' safer whilst actually endangering the lives of pedestrians and themselves.

With pedestrians the arguments are obvious - you get hit by four tonnes of metal travelling at 30mph with a much higher wheelbase you are more likely to get sucked under (especially children) which will injure you more. But the most common reason for owning one is to "make themselves and family safer" so clearly these type of owners don't care about strangers. Especially when they have 'fake' bull bars to really finish off all the dangerous beasts they might encounter on the school run (e.g. children).

Another argument is human health, if you own one and are not bothered about pedestrians inhaling low level air pollution at least be aware that air pollution concentrations inside vehicles have been measured to be higher than outside, and further that particles, low level ozone, nitrogen dioxides and other nasties might be the reason your child is so weak in the chest and developing asthma as they sit in slow moving/stationary traffic fumes on the way in. Plus, the fact that they are used mainly for child carrying in the city (from what I've seen they all emerge at school time) the lack of exercise also contributes to fat unhealthy kids. Put that with the excellent statistic from Mr Glen about school run deaths you have a pretty solid argument against the use of 4x4s (and really cars in general for school run in cites).

There are of course people who drive them as a status symbol in cites, but thankfully I don't know anybody who gets impressed by that so I can't comment on what they are trying to prove. I just think they are stupid and selfish.

Sports cars do also pollute a lot, but I don't see too many of them around and I can at least see over the top of them. Also, if I was hit I wouldn't be sucked under. But, they could be travelling a lot faster...

I don't buy all this stuff about freak snowstorms - according to the Scandinavian people I've talked to (and they know about snow!) they suggest low wheel base and an ordinary 4x4 car with studded tyres is the best thing. It is laughably stupid to raise your centre of gravity. For the UK, if you are concerned an car 4 x 4 with better than average tyres will do it, go to a driving school and learn the techniques, there's a lot you can do. Volvo export more 4x4s to the US than they sell in Sweden. In the USA there are 147 road deaths per million people, in Sweden there are 59.

One of the good things about the U.K. (at least historically) is that we take an interest in what we are all doing as a society and try and develop as a nation. Sadly we seem to be going the insular way of the USA, where we spend more time in our cars rather than interacting with others...and we have small distances to cover so we don't even have such a huge need.

I can appreciate genuine work needs for them, basically if you're getting muddy and needing to work hard at your driving (i.e. not possible to be on phone at same time!) then enjoy it, cos off road driving is fun. If you carve up the countryside to pretend you have a need then you can try and guess what I think (hint: it's not a compliment).

Finally (sorry for the long answer, but I feel strongly about this), check out the flyers for urban 4x4s.

Answer 2

1

Answer 3

I have horses and live on a farm, my 4x4 is not essential, but after struggling with a fiesta and then ford escort van, it certainly makes life a lot easier.....and occasionally I like to drive into town, I can't afford two cars!

I do live near a very posh area, and I call the women that drive their kids to school in 4x4s the Mothers From Hell, they have no regard for other road users and have complained about horse poop on the road!

Any car travelling over 30mph is likely to kill a child, its the driver that is the most important component.

Personally I'd like to ban motorbikes.

I also resent the gas guzzling label... I walk to work most days to keep fit and use my car only 3 or 4 times a week, so a person travelling 70 miles a day to work in their fiesta uses more than I do.....put all the road tax etc onto petrol and diesel, then noone can avoid paying it and people pay according to the amount they use the roads....less complicated than tolls and much fairer, and no need to create an army of pen pushers, the system to collect tax from fuel is already in place!

Answer 4

Hang on a minute! I have a 4x4 and for a very good reason. My job takes me all over the county and I missed out on a lot of work a few years ago because I couldn't get through the floods and on one occasion it took me three hours to travel two miles because of a freak snowfall. I also do a fair bit of off road driving so it doesn't take a lot of working out to see that a 4x4 was a brilliant solution - I haven't missed any work since I bought my 4x4 three years ago. If you happen to see me in my 4x4 driving round London (which is quite likely) it is because, contrary to popular belief (because I own a 4x4), I can't afford a second car just for this purpose. My car is my livelihood and if people like yourself don't appreciate it then so be it. By the way, what have 4x4's got to do with mobile phone users? The ones I see on their phones whilst driving tend to be the younger generation and truck drivers. I was also under the impression that quality of driving had something to do with your chances of causing a fatality on the road. Just one more thing - I am intrigued to know what you think is a normal car. Would you ban Australians from driving vehicles with a "roo" bar?!

Answer 5

Here we go again. Why do so many people think large car = 4X4, or 4X4 = large car? If I drive a volvo V5 into London it's ok. If I drive a C90 it isn't, because that has 4 wheel drive. Same size car, same body, but one is 4 wheel drive. If I drive a Suzuki Jimny into town or dare to collect my children from school in it, that's a no-no. Of course it's ok to use a BMW series 7 or any other large car as long as it only has 2 wheel drive. Does anyone who lives in the city NEED a car capable of 150mph? I will continue to drive my trusty Discovery until some one can give me a good reason not to. Who do I ask if I need one? You? Who the hell are you to decide if I need one or not. I bought it, I pay all the bills for it and I subsidise twerps like you who quite possibly use the road more than I do. You stand a much higher chance of being injured or killed by a 4X2 because there are more of them, they are more likely to be driven by idiots and are faster. Yes they are safer, and why on earth shouldn't I buy one for that reason? And by the way, the world is bigger than London. I live in Cumbria, where people are free to drive waht they like where they like. Like all other anti 4X4 fanatics read some independant information about them before you start ranting. Every arguement put forward on here against 4X4's is factually wrong, unless the same critisisms are levelled at 4X2's as well (fuel consumption, size etc). Yes I do feel better for that thank you, and your apologies are accepted.

Answer 6

Yes.

They are more necessary in cities than in many rural areas.
Many cities (and especially West London) have put in ridiculously high "traffic calming" bumps, which cause severe damage to normal cars (and cut down the response time of emergency vehicles, and exacerbate the injuries of ambulance passengers).
The higher ground clearance and more robust suspension components of 4x4s allows them to cope with these obstacles without damage.

In the countryside there are very few such obstacles in the roads, so a 4x4 is only necessary for those that regularly venture off road, or live in snowy areas.

Without this poorly thought-out and poorly implemented "traffic calming" those in the city who never venture off road in the country would not need 4x4s.

Answer 7

ok, we drive a 4x4 which is not by choice, its a company car, which my husband needs due to driving for work in some very inhospitalable terrain that a Ford Mondeo or similar would be stuck in. We live in the city, but he works in the country.

We dont use it for the school run, or popping to the shops, he relly only uses it for work. If we are going out socialising, we walk so we can drink.

If people genuinely need them for the area where they live, I think its ok but when its the poeple who live in the suburbs of towns, I agree with you, I just dont understand. Why would you need a 4x4 vehicle when all you do is drive on tarmac to and from work, school and the shops?? I bet most of these people have never even used the 4 wheel drive option.

At least my hubbys car comes home cacked in mud and sludge where he has actually been using the 4 wheel drive option.

Answer 8

VERY rarely is a 4x4 accually 4 weel drive, and also VERY rarely is a 4x2 even 2 wheel drive, but people like the security of a 4x4 (even a 4x2 4x4; a truck with only 2 wheel drive such as my uncle's old jeep cherokee) because people have a false sense of a bigger vehicle making a safer vehicle (for themselves) for instance, in my dad's '95 cherokee, if he gets rear ended the insurance will have to pay for about a new paint job on the rear bunper, if my dad accidentally rear ends someons else, they will need to rip off the trunk to get my dad's truck off theirs, and there is no way in hell the charge for airbags will go off behind his front bumper

people think the trucks are safer for them ...... thats why 4x4 are popular for a fair percentage, another fair percentage likes them because they look intimidating, and the remainder i believe enjoys the 4 wheel drive in case they need it

Answer 9

I drive one in towns because I supervise construction sites (particuarly in the winter) the ground can become very muddy and churned up, thus a good off road vehicle is required.

Oh john boy, not all 4x4 are gas guzzling polluters, some famous 2 wheel drive monsters can be a lot worse, Astons, Ferraris, Rollers for example.
I think I sense jealousy

Answer 10

4x4 drivers on the whole are dicks, but I sure like driving them (still saving up for one of my own though!).

Whilst they are a real waste in the city, they are the only tall vehicles available. I would much rather be higher up then lower down, and yes I know all about centre of gravity etc etc etc!

Also, 4x4 drivers are not the only idiots who drive, talk on the mobile AND smoke at the same time, I have seen many a BMW driver do that as well!!!!!!