Serious Question: How do members of the middle class justify being fiscal conservatives?

Question

Hasn't history shown that American business doesn't care about its workers?

Examples:
-railroad and steel monopolies (Carnegie, etc)
-political machines (Boss Tweed)
-industrial revolution, low-wage child labor
-modern political lobbying (Jack Abramoff)

I seriously don't understand how middle-class Americans, especially Christians, justify trickle-down, side-supply theory. Does anyone have a website or something?

Thank you, to those of you who take this seriously.

Answer 1

I think many middle class Americans aren’t truly fiscal conservatives in the true sense of the term. Republicans have done a good job of twisting any liberal position on the economy and misrepresenting it to mean the excising of high taxes and wasteful spending of those tax dollars. As a result of the negative connotation imparted to all liberal economic platforms by Republican pundits, many middle class Americans just accept the title “fiscal conservative” just as the only alternative available to the so called “tax and spend craze” of liberal policy makers.

I think most true Christians, who try to abide by Christ’s teachings, especially his views of charity and social justice, find the conservative stance of trickle-down economics to not only be unworkable, but also callous to the poor. It is diametrically opposed to the teachings of Christ. As Luke 12:48 so clearly states: “To whoever much is given, of him will much be required; and to whom much was entrusted, of him more will be asked.” The point being, the burden, whether financial or otherwise, isn’t lessened because one is wealthy. According to biblical principle, the burden should be heavier on those who have amassed great wealth because they have been given abundance from God’s bounty.

Jesus never preached that removing the yoke from the rich will in fact indirectly assist those in the lower economic strata. Quite the opposite. He ordered that the rich give freely to the poor and downtrodden without condition. Here are just a few verses, among many, that demonstrate Jesus’ and his Apostles’ unconditional view of giving:

Luke 6:38 – “Give, and it will be given to you. A good measure, pressed down, shaken together and running over, will be poured into your lap. For with the measure you use, it will be measured to you.”

Mark 10:21 – “Jesus looked at him and loved him. ‘One thing you lack,’ he said. ‘Go, sell everything you have and give to the poor, and you will have treasure in heaven. Then come, follow me.’ ”

1 John 3:16-18 - “This is how we know what love is: Jesus Christ laid down his life for us. And we ought to lay down our lives for our brothers. If anyone has material possessions and sees his brother in need but has no pity on him, how can the love of God be in him? Dear children, let us not love with words or tongue but with actions and in truth.”

A particularly troubling verse to free market loving “Christian Conservatives”, that despise the redistribution of wealth, is found in Acts 2:44-46: “And all that believed were together, and had all things common; And sold their possessions and goods, and parted them to all [men], as every man had need. And they, continuing daily with one accord in the temple, and breaking bread from house to house, did eat their meat with gladness and singleness of heart.”

Well, my word! That sounds down right like the collectivist mentality that is the hallmark of socialist thought. It hardly sounds like laissez-faire capitalism to me.

Given all of this, how can conservatives talk about things like trickle down economics, and the elimination of the welfare state, and still arrogate to themselves the title Christian? Simple, they are either lying about being conservative, or they are lying about being Christian. Most conservatives are lying about the latter.

The Republicans concocted a brilliant strategy where they have convinced the American public that somehow in order to be part of the “moral values” party, which seeks to eliminate things that are abhorrent to most Christian sensibilities, like abortion and gay marriage, requires that one also accept greedy economic platforms as a packaged deal. That is how many Christians got mixed up into conservative fiscal aims. Ultimately fiscal conservatism is not Christian at all. Its time Christians, if that is what they truly are, stop comprising some of their principles in order to get other principles a hearing in the public square. Our platform, the Christian platform, is the one that must be accepted as a package deal. It is all or nothing.

Answer 2

... it's ridiculous... and walter... what company paid for treating their workers poorly? I don't know if I've seen one that has?

it's simply that they think that if they support it... one day, if they work hard... they will make it big too...

the thing is... the reason that they say communism doesn't work, is because people are innately greedily...
but this is the exact same reason that capitalism doesn't work very well too... greed... if they have it... why give it to anyone... why not use your wealth to make more? and that's exactly what they do...

I've heard estimates that 80 percent of wealth is inherited... I don't doubt it... and what isn't inherited, is mainly gained by using that inherited wealth or the benefits that come from it...

look at bill gates... people say he's a self made billionaire... which he is... to a degree... see, his father was a millionaire... and I bet he didn't just go to any public school... and I know he went to an Ivy league school.... even though he made his own wealth, he still had advantages that 90 percent of Americans don't have that helped him gain that wealth...

and if business appreciated workers... no union would have ever formed... no government regulations would be needed... talk about being idealistic... you people take the cake...

Answer 3

Without American business (imprefect as it may seem) there wouldn't be any middle class in the US. Would you rather have America use the Godless socialist/communist economic ideas of Karl Marx and the Democrats?

Free trade may sound like a dirty word to you but in the long run it truely helps the middle class because it provides more jobs. Using tariffs and other so called "protecting methods" slows down the US economy and that hurts middle class America.

The American worker has been the greatest asset to US businesses since the industrial revolution and believe me, American business knows how valueable you are but the econmy like anything else in life is not perfect so there will be ups and downs but guess why thousands of mexicans want to come work in America? It's because they know it's the greatest place to work in the world and that's because of free market capitalism.

Answer 4

So you take a handful of big corrupt organizations and use that as a reason that the middle class should support socialism? Most business owners are part of the middle class. Small business does care about it's workers and small business grows faster under lower taxes. Big business sells products to small business which sells to lower, middle and upper class tax brackets. If big business can invest more as a result of lower taxes it pays off at every level. I just don't see where you libs get the idea that big business is out to screw the people who make it work. All I can figure is you have worked for some really crappy companies or you are way too sensitive and jealous of people being more successful than you.

Liberals see the rich as an obstacle to their happiness.
Conservatives see the rich as a means of becoming successful and achieving financial success.

Answer 5

Fiscal Conservatism for me has to do more with balanced budgets(Where were these fiscal conservatives when Congress and the White House enacted a bloated (and at least partially unworkable) prescription drug benefit last year? Or the lavish farm bill the year before? The appropriations bills larded with pork-barrel "earmarked" spending? Or all the tax cuts that have turned large surpluses into deep deficits?) than the "trickle down theory" -the problem there is it would take maybe 10 years to work-if indeed it does-no one knows. So, I don't like the deficits and don't trust trickle down economics.

Fiscal conservatism is a term used in the United States to refer to economic and political policy that advocates restraint of government taxation, government expenditures and deficits, and government debt

Answer 6

It's nice to see a serious query on here for a change. America is what it is, and the whole world knows it. The justification (to most americans) is that there is a chance that someday they can be the ones in charge, with the money. Most other countries talk about a good work-life balance, and although I wish that it was the case here, it is simply not. Our society is a materialistic one, and the only way to change that is for everyone to stop caring about money. ( Which, as you should know, is incredibly unlikely ) Most people that immigrate here come in search of a better life, more money, etc., things that we take for granted here. As long as that is the primary goal of the populace, things won't change. Besides all that friend, it's been going on so long, and it is so much a part of our lives now, I really don't think people even notice it so much anymore.

Answer 7

Middle class America is prospering. Big business may not care about it's employees but America is still where you can fulfil your dreams. Millions of Americans have started at the bottom and ended up millionaires. More of our children are graduating college and fulfilling essential roles in their chosen professions.

Laborers children are now leaders.

When you criticize why don't you offer at least one small idea how to be part of the answer instead of the part of the problem by complaining.

THAT IS NOT WHAT JESUS WOULD DO.
He didn't try to change governments but to change the hearts and minds of the people.

Answer 8

Trickle down supply side theory works better than any other way that we've found. Socialism has to be imposed from the top down and it invariably causes shortages and disincentivizes the more productive worker as there is no reward for doing a good job.

Life is easier now because of the industrial revolution, which brought an end to child labor. Do you somehow think that children didn't work prior to the industrial revolution? I guess you didn't grow up on a farm.

There's nothing intrinsically wrong with lobbying anyway, if there are 5 million people who want to have their voices heard in Washington DC they hire a smooth talking person to go and schmooze the politicians for them. Would it be better for them to be silenced?

Just some food for thought.

Answer 9

Well I agree on the Vast majority of companies do not really care about there workers. that fairly evident if your a typical middle class Blue collar so to speak person. My husband is a Machinist who works with to manufacture parts from everything from window, to cars, planes, door hinges you name it. that industry has been getting worse and worse, the steel jobs are going overseas, raises have been stagnant for the past 5/6 years. in a occupation that has classically depended on Overtime as a staple is becoming non existent. they are cutting health care benefits to the point of why bother having medical benefits. So I would say that the trickle down effect DOESN'T WORK. And we are taxed to death. almost half of our income goes to all of our various taxes, when is that going to end. we can't afford anymore taxes. I'm a very frustrated American

Answer 10

Being a modern fiscal conservative usually and traditionally means that you believe in investiture and savings programmes, rather than lending and charity.

As to Lobbying, Senator Zell Miller, a Democrat, was booed out of the Senate Chamber by his own party members for trying to halt lobbying. So, I dare say Modern Lobbying is a sin committed by both of the major parties, in this country. The Republicans were just publicized for it. The system that allows PAC's and Lobbies is corrupt, and always has been.

Answer 11

The middle class are the only people that pay any substantial taxes on their income. It would make sense for them to be fiscally conservative to reduce their tax load.

The rich pay very little taxes because most of their income isn't counted as income by the IRS because it is made in the form of interest which isn't taxed until they cash it out by selling stalk or some other asset that it's tied up into.

What we need to do is lower income tax and raise tax on all forms of excessive passive income--stalks, bonds, real estate--anything that you get paid for just owning.

Do you realize that the wealthiest Americans really don't do anything at all for their money?

They are literally so rich that they are paid to be rich.

We need to encourage the middle and lower class to take advantage of passive income by not taxing it at all until it surpasses some set amount in a given year. Let's say something outrageous like 500K. Then heavily taxing it after that.

I'm all about making it possible for people be rich. Even extremely rich, but I think they should have to earn it; not just get paid for having assets accrue interest.