Rid us of the VEIL?

Question

Well done for daring to publish the article today. Though never having been a big fan of Mr Jack Straw, I must applaud him for his comments that represent the vast majority of his constituents. The backlash from this will be huge. I, as many others feel personal insulted when I see a Muslim women veiled in the way that they are. It is in insult to MY way of life, MY country, MY traditions, MY religion and most of all to members of MY family who died to keep this country free from, fanatical, ill-informed, indoctrinated, misguided and brain-washed individuals, who also happened to dress in black.
If I decided to become a devout Christian and decided to walk around Blackburn in a peaked hat with 2 slits for eyes, as they do in Seville, Spain during semana santa, I would be arrested, for racism.
Why are these people here? Is it for the warm inviting climate? Or the welcoming bars or the great and many varied ways we can prepare pork or maybe or scantly clad females and open mindedness of the locals. Maybe not. So why do you come to a country where everything you resent is forefront? Or maybe WE have got it all wrong. If you want to be a topless model, choose Tehran to launch your career, thinking of opening a surfing school?..... has to be the Dead Sea, watch wild wilder beast roaming the plains?.. has to be Iceland. These people chose to live here. By doing so they wanted to live our lifestyle. They have blatantly failed to do that. They have insulted it and disrespected it. In doing so they have also jeopardized the reputation and integrity of the majority of Muslims who can live within the community, practise their religion and mutually share their culture to the benefit of all. We refuse to accept the KKK way of dressing, why should we accept theirs.
If this is such a respectfull and caring religion the first thing you would do is respect the environment you live in and consider the feelings of those around you. Many will cry but we are British, we have British passports, but as the old saying goes....if a dog is born in a stable does it become a horse.?.....yes.. but only when it starts behaving like a horse. if not, well............
Loose the veil or try the USA where no veils are EVER EVER visible. Wonder why

Answer 1

Although I agree with the comments made by Jack Straw, having seen the full article, unfortunately I also think that your reaction is exactly the reason why there will be backlash from the general public.

Now, feel free to correct me if I am wrong (and to be honest I hope I AM incorrect in my interpretation of your 'soliloquy') but you seem to have made less of a point and more of a rant. Moreover, you have misinterpreted the comments Mr. Straw has made.

The article was not a call for mass veil-burning, it was not a call for muslims to "live within the community, practise their religion and mutually share their culture to the benefit of all" by not wearing their veils.

Firstly, it was only the full face veil that was referred to. Although admittedly you didn't specify, your argument was pretty clear that you in theory would include all veils, even those that do not cover the whole of the face - "We refuse to accept the KKK way of dressing, why should we accept theirs." I find that point in particular ridiculous, and am appalled that you would compare a racial hatred lynch group to an religious group that, for the most part, has no quarrel with the non-muslim community. It is ridiculous, provocative statements such as this that will result in the alienation of British Muslims, meaning that perhaps the only group of people who they can turn to for support ARE the religious extremists. And it is also ignorance such as that displayed in your comment that will cause the backlash.

Now that i have addressed one issue, i come to another - why was Mr. Straw right to make such comments? Well firstly it was purely on a practical basis. Face to face interviews such as those referred to in the article obviously cannot be conducted if one of the party can not see the other's face!
Secondly, on a social level. Yes, i am in agreement with you in that the wearing of a full facial veil does not encourage integration in society. Through physical segregation comes mental segregation, and by wearing a veil that covers the whole of the face, physical segregation occurs. If I wore a mask over my face, I would not expect to walk down the street without receiving suspicious looks or anxious glances, and it is the same in this situation. Nevertheless, I believe that in order to gain the respect of the muslim community we need to express ourself eloquently and with understanding, not just with jingoistic ranting.

We pride ourselves on multiculturalism in this country. My home town of Liverpool is preparing to host the Capital of Culture 2008 - so it is hypocritical to suggest that the Muslim community does not make up a valuable part of our society. Yet it is also naive to suggest that we can communicate with people in the street when we cannot see their faces.

However, one solution to this problem is to appeal to the Muslim community, respecting their decision to wear a veil but pointing out that it would be much better for community relations if this were not to be a veil that covers the whole of your face.

So to summarise -

The Muslim community is an integral part of our society. In case the fact passed you by, there are many British Muslims, many white Muslims, and even Muslims who have converted from faiths much more accepted by the British, such as Christianity. The fact of the matter is, we are going to have to live side by side, no matter what your views. And a little bit less of this:

"fanatical, ill-informed, indoctrinated, misguided and brain-washed"

and a bit more understanding and co-operation will help us all. I don't expect this to be a 'best answer', i don't even care, i just think that people should hear two sides of the story.

Answer 2

Yay! Another person who's not afraid to speak his mind!! Oops we'll get branded for being racist next. Sad really because I'm not at all. I want to stand up for MY rights and not the rights of people who think they can do how they please. I think the full veil is offensive, pretty damn scary and most of all a statement against the British culture and should be banned. As most people say, you go to a muslim country and you have to respect their cultures (quite rightly so) but what would happen if you didn't? I dread to think. It's a fact that it's not muslim law to wear the veil in this country so why has there been so much uproar about Jack Straw's comments. This is England and we are very proud of our country so adapt to our ways because then and only then will you be accepted by it's people.

Answer 3

While I'm neither insulted or offended by it you do have a point as regards wearing a veil.
They have left their country and their culture presumably seeking something better for themselves and their children so why would they want to turn this society into the one they were so eager to leave.
As the Australian Prime Minister John Howard basically said " If you want to be one of us, your welcome. If you don't, then don't come here.
Jack Straw has put a question that should be debated and if they have a problem in getting involved in that debate maybe they have come to the wrong country.

Answer 4

I agree and I'm half caste (or is that un PC?) If any one hides their face it creates mistrust. A biker must remove their helmets before entering any shops. So should muslims or any one else.
I also believe that in schools therestoo much about learning other cultures, they should not keep emphasising this difference, but teach morals, and understanding. My school (and I'm old) had a separate assembly for Jewish pupils. We never made a big deal of it, it was just accepted. After assembly we were all the same and treated eachother accordingly. School was school, to learn about the national curriculum, not to learn about cultures instead. If we insist more on integration in schools these barriers will come down naturally as children are much more tolerant. We can learn about different religions when we are older. I have no religion, my mother was Hindu and my father was of half catholic half protestant descent. If I want to find out about these things I can make a decision now I'm an adult and not have it forced down me as a child. I appreciated this method by my parents, to let me decide when it's time. I have many friends for all sorts of places and we don't discuss anything about culture. As far as I'm concerned- I was born in England, am English, dress English and can dip into my 'Roots' whenever I like, and do not force anything onto anyone even my kids. If they want to go to a Mosque, Church, Temple, I'll take them. If I upset anyone, I apologise but in my house you respect me, in yours, I respect yours. Outside we are all the same. Stop pointing out the differences and start pointing to the similarities. Maybe we'll stand a chance. Thanks for reading my rant. I enjoyed it.

Answer 5

I'm with you 100% on this!!!!!!!!

But you must know why we are in this predicament. In America they swear allegiance to their flag and every American is taught from an early age what american values are. In Britain we don't have any such thing. We have "multi-culturism" where people practice whatever backward dispicable cultural practice they want and society is encouraged by the demented limp wristed pseudo-liberal elite to accept this as okay.

The only way out of this mess is to get a real country up and running in Britain with a written constitution and values laid out in words that all immigrants and natives can understand. The decadent British way of live and let live won't work with muslims. Their misogyny is disgraceful and we should be allowed to say that in no uncertain terms.

Answer 6

Was this a question or a statement. My answer to the veil issue is people should not judge others by what they wear, if you are uncomfortable you must be very insecure. If conformity is the case i would have to say that the UK is full of drunken women half naked puking in the streets. Is this what all women should be like in this country?

Answer 7

Can i buy you a pint!

Round of applause for this guy (or girl).

You are absolutely right, try walking around WITHOUT a veil in regions of the middle east. Women can get stoned to death for it. Maybe we should stone women who DO wear a veil over here (this is clearly unacceptable just an example of reversing the situation over here).

Answer 8

Hear hear, i deliver and collect from the ports, as you walk to the counter theres a sign saying,no caps, no sun glasses, your face must be clearly visible,at all times for the video,how would they get on? how do they do passport photo's
easiest form of escape from a crime dress as a Muslim woman

Answer 9

We need a British oath of allegiance where new settlers bow down to an image of the dear Queen.

Also the police should arrest veiled people for racism against white people... just as they would arrest white hoods for racism against black people.

Answer 10

#*$*$ I could go all day with profanities because this is America not MuslimAmerica.

"Wear what we wear or quite simply go back"
I love a country where the women have to hide skin for their man.
Really its quite a turn-on--not!

Why have businesses stopped celebrating holidays for example Christmas?
Answer: Because we don’t want to offend the foreigners.

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