What is an ESTABLISHMENT of a RELIGION? Prayer in school? Ten Commandments in public? A Nativity scene?

Question

The First Amendment says:

"Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof."

So, how is prayer in school, a public display of the Ten Commandments, or a Nativity scene an establishment of a religion?

For there to be an establishment of a religion there MUST BE:

1. A belief in a Supreme Being;

2. A creed (set of beliefs);

3. Rites and ordinances;

4. Ministers -- to teach about God and his will;

5. Tests -- piety of life, accountability to God's will.

It seems the atheists and secularists are INTOLLERANT of religion and religious people. It is they WHO INHIBIT FREEDOM of worship and expression.

It is the courts who have CHANGED the way things use to be. David Barton points out that it wasn’t until Abington v. Schempp in 1963, that, “the Court made its first open and absolute repudiation of the Bible ... in public affairs"

CASSANDRA,

THE JUSTICES YOU MENTION VIOLATE THEIR OATHS BY INJECTING FOREIGN LAWS INTO THEIR DECISIONS INSTEAD OF ABIDING BY THE U.S. CONSTITUTION ITSELF!!!!!!!!!!

CASSANDRA,

The justices you mentioned use European

sources in their decision making of U.S.

Constitutional law. In doing so, they violate

their oaths of office and are traitors to this

country. Keep up trying to support your

anti-religious bigotry. You'll only get in

deeper showing an ANTI-AMERICAN

attitude.

Answer 1

I totally agree! They want to squelch any speech that they don't agree with because they are insecure in their own beliefs and can't handle others who actually have belief systems...of what ever type.

Why is it that Christians aren't trying to get Santa banned from schools, or children from other faiths expressing a greeting during their holiday..... Only the liberals feel they have the right to squelch speech in such a manner.

Answer 2

It amazes me to see that people do not understand what he constitution states. The Constitution states ; Congress shall make no law RESPECTING an establishment of Religion or prohibiting the free exercise of. What this means is ( and you iwll see this if you have an elementary school level english teacher explain it to you) that Congress can make NO laws showing favoritism to one religion over another. Also to understand the intent of our founding fathers look at their writings, The Danbury letter from Thomas Jefferson among others. Our founding fathers wisely realized that Religion has no place in politics. To show favoritism to one religion over another is wrong because it destroys the concept of all men are created equal if their religions happen to be different. The Constitution has NEVER forbidden religious displays on Gov't property the way some people like to twist it. The constitution has always said ALL religions should be given equal respect. For proof of this look at the frieze in the Supreme Court. It not only shows Moses but Mohammed and confucious and Hammurabi. Also it is NOT the courts who have CHANGED things like stated above. they have merely ruled on what our founding fathers expressed in the beginning. Look at article 6 of the constitution it states that any treaties entered into by the US gov't become the SUPREME LAW of the land. Now look at the treaty of Tripoli. Article 11 states; The US gov't is in NO WAY Founded on Christianity. This was passed UNANIMOUSLY by the Congress and signed into law by John Adams, with NO dissent. And if Our nation is supposed to be a christian nation, which brand of Chrisitanity are we? Baptist? Catholic? Mormon? Protestant? So please do some research and see what our founding fathers intended for this country.

Answer 3

Another silly question!

Now, can you justify your claim that "Atheists and Secularists," not that you understand the terms, "inhibit freedom of worship and expression?" Please, name the chrch that has been forced to close, the individual that has been prevented from praying other than in situations where others are COMPELLED to join him or her, one bible or other religious text you are prohibited from reading or printing, one FCC license that has been denied religious brodcasters or one law that prevents you from worshiping.

It is, in fact, christians who truly inhibit liberty and insist on pushing their "faith" on others. It is christians who insist that their "faith" be supported by the taxes of those who do not share it. It it christians who impose themselves on others and support bigotry against those who do not accept their "faith." It is christians who demand that their "faith" be inserted into every aspect of the lives of those who do not share it.

If you want your little public displays, why do you not place them on your own properties? You know, like the one I'm looking at out the window that made the same fuss about a nativity scene on the courthouse lawn last year while not one decoration or religious symbol was displayed on their own property.

As far as the ten commandments, do you really think someone so stupid that they are unaware that stealing and murder are bad things would be able to walk unassisted, let alone read them? And, why limit yourself to the 10 commandments? Why not include the other 260-some? Why not make Leviticus the basis of our laws? Oh, that's right, 90% of christians would end up in prison or simply stoned to death.

You believe that people who lived 6,000+ years ago are better suited to determine how you conduct your life in the 21st century? Great. You're incapable of knowing right from wrong without a book to explain it to you? Fine. You're only able to conduct yourself in a moral and ethical manner under threat of eternal damnation? Fantastic! Live your life that way. No Atheist or Secularist will, or has any desire to, stop you. Just stop inflicting YOUR insecurities and fears on others.

And for all our sakes, STOP WHINING!

Answer 4

I basically agree with you.

The Constitution allows our public officials to believe in a Supreme Being and to say that they do. The Constitution allows our public officials to say that they believe in the Bible. The Constitution allows our public officials to hire clergypeople to lead prayers. It is the public school teachers who are the only exceptions to that.

The Court's overextension of the Establishment Clause goes back further than 1963, though. It started in 1948 with the McCullom case. In that case the Court ordered public schools to stop inviting clergymen to come to public schools and to provide religious instructions to the public school students -- students were not forced to attend the instructions except by their parents. The religious instruction was only to those students who had their parents' permission to attend. In other words, clergypeople are the ONLY ones not allowed to be invited to public schools. It's discrimination against religious leaders.

Many liberals just don't seem to get that their interpretation of the Establishment Clause usually ends up being a contradiction of the Free Exercise Clause.

Answer 5

When public money and public space is used to display the beliefs and symbols of a a religion, then the establishment cause is violated.

I don't want my tax money to be used at all to promote the myths and follies of christianity or any other religion. You don't need our tax money - put up your own creche on your own property.

HOpefully the court changed, they used to say blacks were 3/5ths of a person, too.

Answer 6

Seems to me that common decency and courtesy would preclude the use of a Christian prayer at a government meeting which is attended by Muslims, Jews, other Protestant denominations, etc. Seems to me that it is not fair to require children to recite a pledge to a graven image - that would be the flag - referring to God, whether or not they believe in God and whether or not they believe it okay to pledge allegiance to an object.

I pray wherever I darn well please and follow the scripture that tells me whoever prays with great pomp and show in front of the crowd is not doing it right - prayer is a private personal thing.

Answer 7

you're struggling with on your proper to impose your faith onto others. That a one hundred eighty year-previous definition of a observe supposedly lends you help, or that a historian with sketchy credentials concurs with you, isn't very convincing. Any moron can argue appropriate to the Founding Father's unique purpose. it truly is what they placed on paper that counts, and that develop into the effect of plenty negotiation. i'm optimistic some people back then agreed with you, yet no longer everybody. And bear in mind, liberty back then develop into constrained to white men. develop into that still their unique purpose, and would desire to we honor that purpose?... Be a Christian all you like! do exactly no longer rigidity me to be.

Answer 8

... you can't yell fire in a theater... it's not absolute... and those aren't esablishments...

the simple fact is... if you allow one, you have to allow them all... then you're not getting anything done but a school sponsored prayer to every God on record all day long at school... I know that sounds great to you, but I value education...

you can't stop the world just to impose your religion at every moment of the day... nothing would ever get done in your world...

Answer 9

I completely agree. In the US, "Establishment" is the government decreeing that all citizens must follow the one religion specified by the government and penalizing those that do not. Those who do as you say, who are intolerant of those practicing their respective religions, are the ones in violation of the First Amendment by trying to stop everyone else from practicing their religion.

Answer 10

These are not the things we want public schools doing. Don't you feel they are best left to parents and families.