Do Muslims actually know how they are perceived?

Question

When someone does something to upset the Muslims of the UK (like accidently eating a bacon butty....well come on it dosent take much now eh?) why on earth do they all riot and burn churches to the ground or call for beheadings while claiming that islam is a religeon of peace?.............do they even realise how much damage they are doing to themselves?

Ben E, why would you liken urself to Huntley? hmmmm

Ben H, why would you liken urself to Huntley? hmmmm

Answer 1

Do you know how much damage our leadres are doing. The Press in the far east do read Western articles and reports of speaches. See below for Asian Tribune Article Its what our leaders are saying:

Bush and Islam: Words versus Deeds
Fri, 2006-09-29 03:19

By Nicola Nasser

The wide gap between U.S. President George W. Bush’s words and deeds vis-à-vis Islam and Muslims doomed to failure his speech at the United Nations on September 19, which could neither appease Muslims nor pacify the ever growing Islamophobia.

Hardly a week had passed since his speech than Winston Churchill - author, journalist, former Member of Parliament and grandson of the former British prime minister - was speaking at an American university to condemn "Radical Islam" as posing to Western civilization a threat similar to that of the Nazis and the Soviets. (1)

President Bush has denied that the West is engaged in a war against Islam as a "false propaganda," but confirmed his country’s determination to carry on with its "war on terror" and its "great ideological struggle" at the start of the 21st century exclusively against Muslims and Muslim countries.

"My country desires peace," Bush told world leaders at the opening of the 61st session of the UN General Assembly, adding: "Extremists in your midst spread propaganda claiming that the West is engaged in a war against Islam. This propaganda is false... We respect Islam." (2)

Bush is also on record as saying that "Islam is a religion of peace" and praising Islam's "commitment to religious freedom," statements that were criticized by the popular U.S. televangelist Pat Robertson.

These rare expressions of respect to Islam would have been welcomed by Muslims were they not swept to utter oblivion in the collective memory of the American public by his incessantly flowing anti-Muslim terminology: Islamic radicalism, Islamic fascism, Islamic extremism and extremists, Islamic or Islamist terrorism and terrorists, radical Islamists or Islamist and Islamic radicals, etc.

His September 19 speech was almost exclusively confined to the Middle East, an overwhelmingly Muslim region. The absence of even a reference to the North Korean pillar of his so-called "axis of evil" was revealing enough that his WWIII (3) "on terror" has shrunk to focus exclusively on the Muslim Middle East.

"At the start of the 21st century, it is clear that the world is engaged in a great ideological struggle, between extremists who use terror as a weapon to create fear, and moderate people who work for peace," he said, defining the battle lines of his WWIII.

Four days earlier he identified those extremists as being "Islamic," who "want to impose" their "ideology throughout the broader Middle East." Earlier, on August 10, CNN quoted Bush as saying that, "this nation is at war with Islamic fascists."

He also defined a modern Anglo-Saxon white man’s mission in the 21st century as "our obligation to defend civilization and liberty, to support the forces of freedom and moderation throughout the Middle East." (4)

How can mainstream Muslims perceive Bush or the United States as respecting Islam when their overwhelming propaganda machine is producing this torrential flow of anti-Muslim terminology and their overpowering war machine is disintegrating Muslim societies to pre-state age, allegedly to defend the freedom of American people? How could a leader secure his people’s freedom when he deprives other peoples of their freedoms!

Jim Lobe is a respected reporter of the Asia Times; in a recent article I misquoted him as attributing to Bush’s co-ideologist, Nweit Gingrich, the term "WWIII on Islam." Lobe rightly felt highly indignant that his credibility was compromised by my misquotation. Gingrich did not literary say it by the word, but he and Bush said it in each and every other word.

Bush's "strategies are not wrong, but they are failing," in part because "they do not define the scale of the emerging World War III, between the West and the forces of Islam," Gingrich said. (5)

Bush’s attempt to verbally separate between Islam and Muslims in his propaganda to justify his pre-emptive American militaristic and hegemonic foreign policy is hopeless and doomed to failure.

Five years after U.S. President George W. Bush launched his global war on terrorism, this war has boiled down to a war on Islam: One cannot target all those Muslims, their countries and their Islamic syllabus without targeting their religion.

His global war on terrorism targets "Islamic terrorism" almost exclusively. "Till recently, of the 36 organizations on the U.S. State Department's banned list, 24 were Muslim. The rest were Basque and Irish separatists and leftist groups. There was no Christian, Buddhist or Hindu groups. The State Department also lists 26 countries whose nationals represent an ‘elevated security risk’ to the U.S. Barring North Korea; all are Muslim-majority countries." (6)

Bush’s religious terminology is shooting his unreligious war in the legs, antagonizing not only the mainstream Muslims but also the non-Muslim large Christian minority in the midst of their ethnic compatriots because this minority feels threatened by his inciting anti-Muslim propaganda, which creates an explosive antagonistic environment that plays in the hands of the same extremists whom he uses as a scapegoat for his unjust pre-emptive wars.

"Ignorance" of the Middle East and its people is a false thesis that sometimes is cited as a justification for Bush’s militarist polices and verbal anti-Muslim blunders. But Bush, whose country has been bleeding the region’s oil wealth for a century, could not be credited even with the benefit of ignorance.

All the anti-Islamist terminology cannot blur the fact that the issue is oil. There's no question that controlling the oil and the profits from oil is a U.S. top priority in the Middle East, particularly as Washington is not only bracing for a future competition with China and India for that resource, but also is already in fierce race with Europe and Japan to take hold of the strategic asset, which is getting more precious and more expensive by the day, because whoever sets hands on it will decide who is the future leader of the globalize world economy; hence the U.S. war on Afghanistan in the vicinity of the central Asian oil reservoir and on Iraq in the heart of the Middle East oil reserves huge depot.

In his most blatant self-contradiction Bush declared: "Freedom, by its nature, cannot be imposed, it must be chosen."

However he did not hesitate to arrogantly dictate to world leaders and whipping Muslims into line in his U.N. speech: The world "must," the United Nations "must," the nations gathered "in this chamber (U.N. General Assembly) must", the Muslim world "must," the "leaders" of Iraqis "must," the Syrian government "must;" and to the Hamas-led Palestinian government he had an outright order: "Serve the interests of the Palestinian people. Abandon terror, recognize Israel's right to exist, honor agreements, and work for peace."

Bush accuses Islamists of forcing their version of things on others while he unsheathes his sword out and high to dictate a 21st century white man mission to convert Muslims to a version of Islam that serves U.S. interests.

No wonder the National Intelligence Estimate concluded that the "pervasive anti-U.S. sentiment among most Muslims," is a "movement that is likely to grow more quickly than the West's ability to counter it over the next five years." (7)

And Bush still can't come to grips with the question of "Why they hate us." Bush's line: "They hate us because of our freedoms."

No Mr. President, they hate you because your administration and its predecessors have been for decades depriving them of their liberty, freedoms, resources and elected governments, in a historic trend that extends from removing an elected leader in Iran in the 1950s because of his nationalizing the oil and replacing him by the Shah, a brutal dictator, to suffocating the Palestinian people to squeeze out the elected Hamas-led government from power in 2006.

Bush’s scare tactics aimed at American public should not blur the divide in Bush’s WWIII. The battle lines should be redrawn to be between U.S. and Israeli militarism and military occupation and expansion and the liberation movements that were led by nationalists or Pan-Arabists in the 20th century and now are led by Islamists.

Bush absurdly, unconvincingly and arrogantly postured as the liberator of the Muslim and Arab masses, promoting the U.S. Democracy as a campaign of changing Muslim and Arab regimes, by military force if needed.

However, Muslims and especially Arabs are very well aware that the end of the Cold War and the collapse of the former USSR have made Islam a useful scapegoat for tightening the US grip on the unipolar world. Books by the Orientalist Bernard Lewis and Samuel Huntington's The Clash of Civilizations became popular in the west because they promoted the idea that Islam was the main threat to Western "civilization."

They are also aware that this war to establish total and lasting U.S. global hegemony, a sort of modern-day Roman Empire, is spearheaded in the heartland of Muslims and Islam, the Arab world, where all the regimes are targeted sooner or later; it makes no difference whether they are Islamic, Islamist, secular, liberal, or Pan-Arab regimes, monarchies or republics.

*Nicola Nasser is a veteran Arab journalist in Kuwait, Jordan, UAE and Palestine. He is based in Ramallah, West Bank of the Israeli-occupied Palestinian territories.

Notes

(1) Winston Churchill at the Union University on September 26. Reported by the Baptist Press BP on Sept. 27, 2006.

(2) President Bush’s speech at the 61st session of the UN General Assembly on September 19, 2006.

(3)"WWIII" is a term used by the former Republican Speaker of the House of Representatives Newt Gingrich in a recent speech at the neo-conservative American Enterprise Institute (AEI); he was quoted by Jim Lobe, Asia Times on September 14, 2006.

(4) Bush's news conference at the White House on Friday, September 15, 2006.

(5) Jim Lobe, Asia Times on September 14, 2006.

(6) Praful Bidwai, Inter Press Service, September 7, 2006. Reported by http://www.snpx.com
(7) The Washington Post on September 27, 2006.

Nicola Nasser is a veteran Arab journalist in Kuwait, Jordan, UAE and Palestine. He is based in Ramallah, West Bank of the Israeli-occupied Palestinian territories. Nicola Nasser submitted this article to "Asian Tribune" for publication.

- Asian Tribune -

Some people need to think before they say some things.

Answer 2

How many churches have there been in the UK exactly? None

How many riots? None

Whilst there have been isolated incidents in a worldwide population of over a billion - to hold all account, then I must hold you account for the crimes of every European or Christian or even just every British citizen - Huntley for one.

There is a point that Islam and Muslims seem to lack any objectivity about what Muslims actually do to Muslims. It's part of the culture of shame, and keeping things unsaid, look around the world and find an Islamic country that doesn't have endemic corruption, state torture, restrictions on women's rights and the freedom of speech, racism and rampant nepotism. The only one I can think of is Singapore and it's really just a city, and a pretty draconian one at that.

They forget what life was like under Saddam, they ignore that young girls can be executed by public hanging in Iran for being raped or sexually abused by men, they ignore the headstrong racism across the Middle East that puts Palestinians as something slightly above dog doo with the Saudis royalling it at the top. They ignore the rampant corruption in Indonesia, they ignore Pakistan's spreading of nuclear weapons technology, they complain about our police but say nothing of the Karachi police. All these are facts - not conjecture.

Muslims are all brothers, but not all brothers are equal. There are many factions, some who wish to murder the others, as they wish to us. And then there are the millions and millions, struggling to make their way in the world, being good people, raising families, some right next door, and some right round the world.

If to you they are Osama, then I and you are Huntley

Answer 3

the question is do they care? Religion is just an excuse to be a snob and think you are better than someone else becauxse you pray a certain way or eat a certain thing or dont eat a certain thing imagine if it was a club and not a religion would you join with such stupid rules?
obviously if you kill people because they are different than you then you are extremely holy
i am reading a book about witch hunter general and the same **** about religion comes through. lets hang or burn or torture these old women because they have a mole or a black cat in otherwords cause they are different. Dont get me wrong i believe in a god but mine dont ask me to fly planes into buildings or bomb villages or blow up double decker buses
the thing is these people will actually defeat their own purpose and lets hope they dont get hold of nuclear bombs
oh dear they already have and the worst one is called george bush

Answer 4

Dawa (propogation specialists within islam) give out a very different picture to what the 'Deen' actually is. They are islamic evangelists, to put it loosely. Besides these differences in how others percieve them, they are not one with each other. There are many many sects that turn on themselves daily. If the disbeliever wages war on the muslims, they might unite. The result should be to take each muslim into account on his/her own merits. This may prove very difficult in a society that likes blanket labels. And where they may fear to explain their personal interpretation. Also, in the sway of a strong community (Ummah) individuals may be wrangled into following a political stance that they don't actually agree with. Some muslims I know are equally upset and depressed with their own community politics as they are with western politics. I am a hellenist pagan and even though I'm polytheist (and should be dealt with in a nasty way according to the Koran) the muslims treat me with respect because I am respectful to them. They need a break and a chance to express their individual views without being bullied / shamed by their community or picked on /judged with prejudice before they even get the chance to speak. If we look at the British Empire, many colonial troops such as Bengali lancers provided elite, loyal and stalwart fighters who served and died with glory for the King/Queen of England. Its a very very difficult situation. No judgements!

Answer 5

From the American perpsective.

We don't know any more than how Christians are perceived by other faiths.
I don't buy into this " my god is bigger than your god " rhetoric.
The last 4 Crusades did not make the world a better place.
I truely think the evangelical " Christians " who listen to Falwell, Pat Robertson, Reed, are no more Christian than the followers of the radical mullahs advocate terrorism in a political cause as a means to an end. A pox on all their houses.
Anyone that really reads the Koran knows that many if its so called followers are so...only in name.

Answer 6

People who riot and destroy other religious places in the name of Islam are not Muslims, they are fundamentalists..pawns being used by politicians. We common people don't understand politics nor do we understand how the mind of a fundamentalist works. They don't have a cause they just create a riot to distract people. But the sad thing is, Islam is a religion of peace but some people have messed up the preception of Islam. The killings and hatred will continue till someone does not stop taking revenge for the mistakes of the past. Islam tells you to love your neighbour and seek forgivness not only from God but from his people

Answer 7

I don't wish to offend you but I don't follow any religion as for this is a pretence to keep the poor,poor and the rich,rich,and also it's the proses of new world order which is not good for us.In reply of your quistion though muslim's and every one elses religion beliefs think their's is better than the other that is why they carry on like they do.
But in further relation to your quistion muslims think their the end all and be all and their race is the best.

Answer 8

Muslims should never have attempted to enter the United Kingdom if they were so reluctant to integrate will Christian and Protestant British Citizens. They do know what we think of them but they use it against us. Muslims are allowed to burn the British flag and the bible but we can't draw a cartoon about the profit Mohammed

Answer 9

Do Christians actually know how they are perceived?

When are they going to realise that the British Isles are a pagan land?

Bloody Christians! Coming over here, stealing our festivals, burning our women!

About time they buggered off back to Judea, where they came from.....

Answer 10

I really don't think they do. It is so hard as a non-muslim to understand what on earth their grievances are, esp. the ones born and brought up in this country (UK). I mean, one of my friends who is a catholic said that when she was at church last week she heard that the catholic churces in our area had received death threats. I mean for goodness sake. I really wish I understood what their problem really is.

Answer 11

Probably the Muslims that actually do the rioting and cause most of the damage don't know how they are perceived because they have immersed themselves in the world of their local cleric and he or his staff tell them everything they see, hear and know. Then if they learn of being seen in a negative light, then the cleric is right there to reassure them that they are still doing the right thing.