America can't be critical of it's own government without being labelled anti American?

Question

It seems that anyone who questions Bush or any US policy is labled as anti US - What a wonderful way to inspire fear limit debate and allow band wagon policy's to go unchecked.

For years I have had the legal and cultural privilage of being as critical of Canada's government and policy and never had to face the base attempts to intimidate me as I see those in the US suffer at the hands of so called freedom loving American conservatives.

My question is that kind of simplistic name calling and blatant scare tactics your version of freedom? I certainly feel I have more rights as a Canadian than you have as an American if that is the answer.

So what is with the hypocrasy and the blind belief that if you don't swallow Bush's views your a traitor - are you sure your not a facist nation?

Now before you regurgatate some memorised put down stop and at least try to answer the question in some fashion

Ray
Level 6

My point is that only some in your nation seem to have the right to a voice and the right to an opinion . Any one who argues seems to be relegated to lunitic or traitor - Poland should have been a little more worried about german politics than it was is what I am getting at

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birdsnakecat...
Level 4

Only traitors are critical and disrupting when troops are fighting.
No matter what country you're from.
Perhaps you should worry about the French in your own country.

Supporting the troops and supporting the policy that puts them in harms way are two very different things and no one south of the border seems to get that.

As to the French in Canada why on Earth would I worry about them - are they in trouble do they need help?
The divisive nature of your comment won't catch on here as well as it has at home

fathead

To a degree and at times I do but you may be on to somthing in that I am playing by a rural Canadian cultural rulebook as much as you are American (rural urban executive labouer etc)

The difference in response if you have ever seen the very vicous House of Common Question period is that all concerned shoot back not slogans but cutting platforms and so forth. This is why our TV shows tend to be horribley boring expecially compared to the of the US.
There are three parties in that House somtimes more all competeing and remember no one can be sued or charged for anything said in the House of Commons - When they leave they are expected to go back to soft gentle spoken individuals -
The goal here is not in my opinion to shut you up as it seems in the US but to prove you wrong - or get you to expose a osition so I can learn from it and either incorperate that or defend agianst it. Remember we never left the British Parlimentary syestem and it's great/horrible

Answer 1

Well said.
This American is standing up and applauding.
And no, I'm not sure we're not a fascist nation.

Answer 2

Trout...

You ask a question, request a reasonable response, then you attack.

I'll take the high road and respond to you and I'll keep the name calling to a minimum.

"It seems that anyone who questions Bush or any US policy is labled as anti US"

That isn't true. You know it isn't true. Please show me where debate has been limited. Please show me the fear that has silenced so many Americans. Please show me where policy has gone unchecked. Quite the opposite.

"My question is that kind of simplistic name calling and blatant scare tactics your version of freedom?" *What* kind of simplistic name calling? The word *that* doesn't tell me much. Name calling comes from those who aren't intelligent enough to hold a conversation and debate issues on their merits.

"I certainly feel I have more rights as a Canadian than you have as an American if that is the answer." What answer??? Seems to me like you are having a conversation with yourself. By the way, I'm happy for you if you are secure in the level of rights you have. I feel comfortable with the number of rights I have in my country. You should be happy for me as well.

"So what is with the hypocrasy and the blind belief that if you don't swallow Bush's views your a traitor - are you sure your not a facist nation?" Excuse me... who's calling names, me or you? Anyways, yes, by the very definition of Fascism I am absolutely positive that the United States is not a Fascist country. I'm sorry to say, I think you are confused if you honestly believe we are Fascists. Tell you what, I'll let you explain to us why you believe we are a nation of fascists. Please, give detailed answers and stick to the definition of Fascism. Try not to use name calling. (If you can)

"Now before you regurgatate some memorised put down stop and at least try to answer the question in some fashion " Exactly who is being disrespectful here? Me or you? I answered your question I do have to admit though, I had trouble distinguishing your questions from your "put downs".

What do I consider to be anti-American?

Any American who *knowingly* would bring comfort or aid to the enemy. The enemy in this case could be considered as terrorist organizations who want to kill innocent civilians to further their cause.

I would consider any American who CLEARLY PROMOTES the destruction of my country as being anti-American.

My list is actually very short. Now if you were to put the word Canadian in those sentences where American is used, wouldn't you feel the same way?

Answer 3

You may FEEL you have more rights than a US citizen but you are missing the point that people can say anything they want about the government...yes, and be called anti-american...and it means NOTHING. THAT is the point. The right to free speech is so deeply rooted in society that the "you are unpatriotic" response is EXPECTED. It does NOT hamper criticism; if anything it makes the criticism louder.

Start looking back; pick a president, any president...1963? 1863? The same claims of "unpatriotic" behavior were lodged against those of the out-of-power party. Did it stifle those being called names? No.

The immediate jump to call you a traitor is EXACTLY like you calling Bush a terrorist. Hyperbole and politics. Name calling is the ante, not any determination of truth. It is designed to elicit an over-the-top response to be used as an example of the irrational nature of the opponent.

The difference you are seeing between Canadian and US politics and behavior is not limited to this realm. I would hazard a guess that this difference is one of the leading reasons US sales people have trouble moving into (specific) international postiions. The American in-your-face, blunt, and intimidating approach makes many people very uncomfortable.

Given the over-the-top and extreme nature of your statements/questions, I assumed you knew this and were/are playing indignant non-american in the standard "grab the higher ground" tactic of political debate.

Answer 4

It is true that, historically, sitting presidents have used the Oval Office to limit attacks (Clinton liked the F.B.I) So what? To a real American, it doesn't matter. Bush can label me whatever he wants. If I want to speak my mind, and am crosswise with one or more of his policies, I will grab a soap-box and have at it.

There is an element of your question that I find disturbing, and that is the equation of labeling with Fascism. This is a slam at the millions of people that were crushed under Hitler's boots. They weren't shy and retiring. The people suppressed by the Third Reich were done so at gunpoint. A mere hint or label would have had no effect, just as it has no effect today.

Any such attempt here would result in a quick and decisive response. Because of our cherished right to keep and bear arms, the good people of Washington are very careful to stop short of our doorsteps. And this, my friend, above all other reasons, is why America remains free, and will never fall prey to the likes of Hitler and his minions.

If you question whether or not we cherish our freedom, why don't you come on down and try to snatch some away? By the way, I sympathize, in that you certainly have had good reason to criticize your government and policy.

Answer 5

That a Load. The United States more than any country allows you to be critical of the country openly. We print, speak and show it in all aspects of the media. What Bush does is try to label you anti-American if you don't follow his ways but Americans don't buy it. To prove my point there have been no mass arrests. What you see and hear is Bush and his cronies trying and not succeeding at invoking War support. Only with major wars has the US population come together as a group in support of the American way and label people anti-American. During those times you had Demonstrations and arrests. It is driving bush crazy that he doesn't have this fanatical support

Remember Bush did not win the election outright. He does not even have half the support of the US and only half of them support the war.

Why do people think America is their president. No president ever won 100% of the vote.

Answer 6

I am/ was a conservative Republican. I think Bush is the worst president ever. Go ahead and constructively criticize. Don't think because some don't speak out they approve of what is going on. We have a political correctness that has kept people from speaking out. This is an administration of intimidation. It has shown it's self to be incompetent, inefficient, and crooks. Soon the people will vote. One can only hope they will look past party and vote individual for the good of America. Our largest problem to date, has been to find someone who actually cares about legal Americans over their own desire for wealth at any price.
I want to add, I also have family members in the war. I don't feel have them as ducks in a shooting gallery is supporting them. While Bush collects more millions from his oil revenues.

Answer 7

a guy or woman could desire to shaggy dog tale yet I have not got something against your Auntie. All joking aside a query of why people who accuse human beings of bein Anti-American and additionally say The UN is ineffective do not ask electorate of the worldwide to connect U.S. electorate in an attempt to restrain the wars U.S. electorate are adverse to. the alternative grew to become into made at Nuremberg that Wars Of Agression have been crimes The Nazis have been liable for for this reason anynation which does thar could be constrained via the guideline and The UN. U.S. electorate can use this regulation and do a UN challenge of their very own united states as their united states has been liable for multiple wars of agression. there's a word Evil Prevails while sturdy adult adult males do not something. nicely there have been multiple circumstances U.S. electorate have not taken this option to place an end to this. Anti-conflict Protests are sturdy yet this may be greater clever. To sign The Human suitable To Peace The Human suitable to possess the planet and safeguard organic materials into constitutions as rights for electorate could additionally help.

Answer 8

We can be critical of our own government. Will we catch hell? Oh yeah. Last night I had the pleasure of talking to an independent candidate running for the U.S. House of Representatives. We talked about many things including the fiasco in Iraq. We were standing in a crowd with perhaps 300 people and we talked in hush tones because we knew there were people who would not be pleased with the comments we made during on conversations. We are middle of the road on many issues but felt strongly that our government was headed in the wrong direction. After our conversation I said to my wife "He doesn't have a chance in hell of getting elected." She asked me "Why, he seemed like a very intelligent man?" I told her he was very intelligent and discussed all the issues freely, that's the problem, he told the truth and people just don't want to believe it." America for the most part is brainwashed so thoroughly that to even think against the machine is taboo. Americans care more about the #1 television show or their favorite sports teams. To be labeled anti-American would show that people were at least paying attention. Sad to report but most of the population doesn't even care any more.

Answer 9

Only traitors are critical and disrupting when troops are fighting.
No matter what country you're from.
Perhaps you should worry about the French in your own country.

Answer 10

it's the same as in the 50s and 60s when everybody was labeled a Communist