Another question about our government?

Question

So "Separation of Church and State" comes from Thomas Jefferson's letter and was tied in with the 1st Ammendment. The interpretation varies as to the meaning of the two but ultimately decided by the Supreme Court. Ok, so without religion, where do we get our basis for right and wrong? Obviously our founding fathers were religious men or held the morals of their "christian" faiths. So today where does that put us? How do we decide right and wrong without it? I've not looked all this up in a long long time and am jumping back into all this wonderful stuff. Is it simply the Supreme Court justices that decide what they think? Got any websites for reference for me?

BTW...I really enjoy yahoo answers and I love reading everyones responses whether I agree or disagree. I continually learn new things so thanks to you all :)

Answer 1

Many of the founding fathers were deists. Deists believed that instead of believing in God out of revelation, tradition, mysticism, etc. one should believe in God out of reason and logic. This belief in God out of logic led them to find secular morals instead of ones derived out of tradition.

Many of these morals were derived from Enlightenment philosophy. Most notable is probably the writings of English philosopher John Locke.

As far as the justice system, it is the justice's job to determine whether an act is constitutional, not whether it is moral. Unfortunately, this distinction has been blurred recently due to an uprising in activist judges. To decide on the constitutionality of an act, the judges hold the constitution as the primary source. Many originalist judges will also respect stare decisis and use common law. Many activist judges will influence their decision more on their opinion.

While we have no way of forcing the more activist judges to use a more secular moral system, it would probably be a moot point anyways as most secular moral systems agree with most religious moral systems on most of the points.

Answer 2

I agree and was thinking about that very thing the other day, except it had to do with atheists. Anyway, if you actually read the 1st Amendmant, it says this about religion: "Congress shall make no law respecting the establishment of a religion".
It continues on, but contrary to popular belief, the Constitution says NOTHING about separation of church and state at all!
All it said was that Congress cannot establish an official religion and that the government cannot abridge thr right of anyone to practice their religion. Period.
The separation of church and state came into being after the Supreme Court made a ruling on a case and it set a precedent.
That is where that bull came from. Some justices decided that they new better than the Founders. Go figure.

Answer 3

To begin with, there is a big difference between morals and ethics. Morals are a personal thing, ethics are the social thing.. (how we treat each other.) Don't presume to put your morals on me, but we can discuss ethics and manners.

Manners is actually the easier of the two as it basically is making everyone around you as comfortable as possible.

Ethics is a much broader arena, and a study of ethics would help you understand how important it is to separate church and state in our government. If all Christian doctrines were made into laws, then most of us would be criminals, some just for existing at all.

Most of our society does not understand the difference between morals and ethics, and therein lies much of the problems of communication and understanding. What is between me and my god has naught to do with you or anyone else.. this is about morals. What I do to you, how I behave towards you, how I affect your life, this is ethics. With good ethics I will not wrongfully imprison you, torture and kill you, as the US goverment is doing right now to so many at Guantanamo Bay. I will not with good ethics collect taxes and lead my people into a war on false information, as the current administration is doing. I would not break the laws of my own country and do wiretaps, violate the constitution and claim I have a right to do that when even the supreme court has ruled I am in the wrong as Bush is doing..

Of course I am not likely to be elected president any time soon, and the crazy relative I have who runs every election on the prohibition party ticket we will continue to pray is never elected either.

Answer 4

Religion is a personal choice and most of us have some background with it. That's where our laws come in from religion. It should never dictate policy like its trying to do now. We are a nation of free people to practice whatever we want but we dont have the right to inflict others with our ideas or moral standards. That takes away our freedom as Americans. That's where the separation of church and state are. Also, people are inherently good and know right form wrong.

Answer 5

Laws can be based on objective effects and rational cost-benefit analysis, independent of religion or morality.

So, while many people might prefer laws to based on their religious beliefs, either because it's easier to just adopt and existing set of rules or because they want to impose there beliefs on others, neither is required.

And the beliefs of our Founders varied considerably. Many were Deists, and rejected religion even though they believed in God. But more importantly, they realized that religion and politics were both too powerful to be allowed to combine. It's too dangerous a combination.

So, secular laws should be based on objective measurable concepts and effects, and that leaves religion free to whatever it wants within its own domain, without control over the state or interference from the state. As long as the church obeys the same general purpose laws as everyone else.

In other words, no special treatment for religion, for or against.

Answer 6

The first amendment only prohibited the government from establishing a state church. The supreme court with the backing of the ACLU and atheists has decided display or religious objects in government buildings in unconstitutional.

Answer 7

I believe every law is determined by whether or not it violates another person's rights, not based on morality as dictated by a religion.

To kill violates ones right to life and freedom. To rob your neighbor violates the right to own your own possessions and be free from oppression from a thief.

No doubt the rights that we posses that are integral in the Judicial system may have been based on a religious idea, no one here regardless of religion will deny that we have the rights we are given in the constitution.

Answer 8

Morals and Christian belief has nothing to do with another. When you read up on what the "holy" Roman church did throughout the centuries you will get sick to your stomach. Our founding fathers knew that and despite them being of Christian belief they wanted to have a fresh start in this country. They have seen what the power of the Church can cause and they didn't want to have any piece of that. Of course they allowed the exercises of religious beliefs and that is alright. As long as they keep it private and doesn't spill into any government it is fine. Of course the Bush junta violated those basic principles and the constitution.

Answer 9

While religion has been a great benefit for a large number of people as it helped them to establish a uniform set of morals or ethics, it is not required for a determination of what is right and what is wrong.

Morals and ethics by themselves can be taught and learned, and in fact once you take them out of a religious environment and place them, as is, on the table, they are absorbed by children rather quickly because you can put them into words and stories that makes sense for them and their upbringing.

Hope this helps.

Love as always,

Sebastian

Answer 10

Church and State is simply designed to prevent the establishment of an "official" national religion