He who dies before he dies, does not die when he dies?

Question

Erhm.......what do you think this zen saying means?

Ego death? The realization of our true nature--that which doesn't die? Awareness or consciousness?


thanks.....

Answer 1

maybe its that coming out of the wheel of life and death while living and thus knowing everything about nothing. then that person would have no such need and could go from this world at wish and is wise enough to know its idiocy to live forever. therefore that person never actually dies but takes a willing exit to enter some other dimension.

some people like osho, vivekananda said the same thing though differently and relating it to their own lives.

great saying!

Answer 2

I'm not sure what that means--I can understand the metaphor of "dying before you die," but not the second part. Unless the second part implies, "...because you're already dead."

I don't recall where, but there's a people (maybe one of the Native American tribes) who believe that we actually (well OK, metaphorically) die three times. The first is when we actually physically die. The second is when we are buried or cremated, never to be seen again. And the third and final death, is when we disappear from the memory of the living and are forever forgotten to history.

As far as I'm concerned though, one death is one too many for me. :-) Awareness & consciousness are functions of a living brain (we know enough about brain function to know this is true), and as such when we die, there is only oblivion waiting for us. This may not sit well for those who believe in or wish there to be an afterlife, but for me it only emphasizes the importance of living your life to the fullest in the here & now.

Answer 3

He does not die when he dies because to die would mean he went before his time was due. This could also mean that if he died spiritually, then when it was his time to die physically, that he has recapurted his spirit before his physical death, so that in essence, he doesn't loose his spirit again, even in the final death. He learned a lesson the first time he died spiritually. He know now, how important it is to keep the vibe, the spirit, or what ever you want to call it. And when it's time for him to leave this earth, his body perishes, but his spirit remains alive. So in essence, he does not die.

Answer 4

Hi linty,

This saying encompasses a lot. There is a series of deaths that take place which result in liberation. The one this saying speaks of is the death of the attachment to form. I'll quote someone who explains it well,

"By death I mean extraction from form conditions - physical, emotional or mental; I mean cessation of contact (temporarily or permanently) with physical form, with astral glamor and with mental illusion; I mean the rejection of Maya, the name of that all-inclusive effect which overwhelms a man who is immersed in materialism of any kind, and is therefore overcome (from the soul angle) by life in the three worlds."

Me again: so you see this death is the death of that which holds us back and veils the spiritual world from our view. Therefore when our physical body dies we do not because that physical form is merely a vehicle for the soul to express itself in the physical world. It's like we stepped out of the car (the physical body) and we move on without it.

Does that make sense?

Answer 5

Lance_Link just slapped me hard ! .. What was that for ... ouch!

"death of ego" .. can also be a nascent event , of an entirely new identity in it's complex .. that yes .. has more eternal sensibilities .. the ego is still there, with even it's instincts iintact ... what once was just a mule .. has a chariot driver now ...

Answer 6

It means that One who dies to the world , to its desires, to its attachments, will have a spiritual life and that even when he dies a physical death, he will will be still living through his spirit.

Answer 7

this is the reason that ignorance is bliss,

it means that when a person dies mentaly, then die physically, they do not die when the die physically saying that when you have no mind, you know not your body, leaving it dead... this does not litterally mean vegetative state but it apply's when a part of you dies

Answer 8

It means you can't die if you are already figuratively dead. So yes, death of ego I'd say.

Answer 9

He who dies before he dies, does not die when he dies?

It means he that knows death awaits all, also knows that yet he is alive, how can life thus avaid him?

Answer 10

That's right. Because he is already dead. So to be awakened is to realise that there is no death merely an altering of states.