This is for anyone who has read Plato's The Apology?

Question

I just got dome reading it and it is very compelling and truthful but what I am wondering about is if Socrates is so down to earth and humble why did he say that he was God's gift to the people? And if he was not scared of death and did believe that he did nothing wrong why did he propose a fine that his friends would pay off for him? Im sorry if it is an ignorant question but I am new to philosophy and feel that the only way to know something is to ask questions. Thanks in advance for your comments.

Answer 1

The Apology is one of th eost beautiful works I've ever read. The title is interesting in and of itself because it challeneges the sole definition of the word 'apology'. As you read The Apology, you come to the realization that Socrates is doing anything BUT apologizing. He is persecuted for 'corrupting the youth of Athens' and is sent to death by poison.

Socrates consideres himself a gift to the world because he was uinlike others. He was "the wisest" among men. Why? Because although all men consider themselves wise, they fail to acknowledge that they are fallible. On the contrary, what made Socrates the 'wisest' was the fact that he knew that he knew nothing. In oher wods- as confusing as it may sound- Socrates knew and acknowledged what other men did not: that he was a fallible being.

Now, in reference to your other question, Socrates never offers his friends to offer money for his release. What he does do- when his friends come to aid him in escape- is pose hypothetical scenarios and gives them resolutions. For example, he mentions that if he were to escape and flee to anoher land bordering Athens, he would be considered a law breaker there as well and would not be welcomed. Also, he considers a scenario where his friends pay off a guard to release him. If this were to take place, reasons Socrates, his friends would eventually be persecuted financially an dotherwise and his loved ones would no longer be safe. If you think about it, the best choice for Socrates was death.

I hope this helped.

Answer 2

Plato was not only a philosopher, but a dramatist. As to exactly what Socrates was and did, we'll never know. We know him only as a character from Plato's writings, as well as some brief portrayals by others like Aristophanes and Xenophon.

Why would a dramatist/philosopher present a character that suffered from conflicting passions and apparent hypocrisies? That is the way a writer must present characters to give those characters three dimensions. No one who is truly human and truly honest ever truly believes only one thing all the time. In fact, throughout Plato, Heraclitus, the Christian mysteries, the Philosophies and religions of the east, it is the contemplation of the paradox of humans being able to hold two mutual exclusive, yet both seemingly true, beliefs at once that ultimately leads the way to enlightenment.

Socrates was a gift from the Gods because of his wisdom. He refuted this. When the oracle at Delphi named him the wisest man, he thought that there must be some mistake, because he knew himself to be the most ignorant of men. Later, after speaking with lots of people, he came to the conclusion that the oracle was right. He was the wisest of men, because, at least, he knew how ignorant he was. Everyone was equally ignorant, but all had fooled themselves into believe they had some sort of absolute knowledge.

Answer 3

The problem, when we read most of the dialogs is whether we are reading the words of Socrates (who did not believe in writing down his ideas) or Plato (who wrote the dialogs for his school.) Supposedly when Socrates heard one of the early dialogs he said, "what a liar he (Plato) has made of me." None-the-less, the one place where all ancient sources agree is the Apology, these are probably Socrates' own words. What is important is that from the beginning he recognizes that his opponents have manipulated the system and he opens by saying he knows the truth, god id the only judge of the truth, he hopes the Athenians will hear the truth - but he does not care. Then he goes on to make an important point that is the key to your questions, he says, " In obedience to the law I will now make my defense. " In other words, he starts by saying the whole trial is false, but as he has always obeyed the laws, he will follow the law even now and offer a "defense" according to the customs of Athenian law. he proceeds to answer his accusers one by one. in the course of this he answers your questions:
1) Why if he is humble does he say he is gods gift? He has two reasons
A. He is not a "gift of god" like a great hero, he is "a ludicrous figure" in fact a gadfly an annoying insect, "I am that gadfly which God has attached to the state, and all day long and in all places am always fastening upon you, arousing and persuading and reproaching you."
B. He is not "proud" being this gift, in fact he does what he does out of duty, "Strange, indeed, would be my conduct, O men of Athens, if I who, when I was ordered by the generals whom you chose to command me at Potidaea and Amphipolis and Delium, remained where they placed me, like any other man, facing death, if now, when, as I conceive and imagine, God orders me to fulfill the philosopher's mission of searching into myself and other men, I were to desert my post through fear of death."
2. You asked, if he were not scared of death, why offer to pay a fine? According to Athenian Law - a person accused of a crime could offer an alternative punishment, usually exile. This is what Socrates' accusers expected him to do - leave the city. Socrates makes an "ironic" proposal that he knows is unacceptable. We can see this in the notes to the famous Jowett (famous Oxford professor) translation, " Socrates is convicted of the charges by only the slimmest of margins and gives a second speech. In Athenian jurisprudential practice, the accusers asked for a certain penalty if the accused is convicted, and the accused argues for a different, usually more lenient penalty. For instance, if the accusers ask for the death penalty, it was customary for the accused to ask for banishment. The lesser punishment tended to be chosen in just about every case. Socrates' second speech is an argument for a different penalty rather than death, but Socrates argues that he is doing a great service to the state of Athens, so that the appropriate penalty would be to pay him a stipend for the rest of his life to support him in his criticism of individual citizens of Athens."
So in both your questions, Socrates was using satire/humor and irony as means of undermining ideas - as he had done in so many of the dialogs. By the way, as Socrates would say, there are no ignorant questions - questions are the beginning of knowledge. Here is a fun web site on the apology the outlines the structure of the arguments:
http://plato-dialogues.org/tetra_3/apology/plan.htm
have fun

Answer 4

As a completion, about Socrates' death, when he was condamned to death, his friends convinced the authorities to comute the decision into the payment of a consistent fine, and then they came with the money, moment in which Socrates refused to accept this action, therefore drinking his poison.
Of course, there are some who say that the reason for this was his nagging wife, Xanthippe... :).

Answer 5

Its been a while since I read The Apology so I try my best when I say:

I think when he said he was God's gift, he wasn't trying to say I am special or anything. It is more like, men have become too boastful with their own knowledge that they forget that they do not know everything.

Im not aware of the fine he proposed to his friends. which part of the book is that from and what circumstances did he say it?