Is it terrorism when Lebanese and Palestinians fight back or is it a legitimate struggle against occupation?

Question

tabun1015, kind of like what Israel is doing, correct?

amable..yes, I would. No question.

Rich E...Israel is only defending, not attacking??? Where do you get your info?? There are hourly, YES, hourly attacks on Palestine without reason except to attack, kill and oppress.

Hendry...here is a brief history of the conflict.

http://www.mideastweb.org/briefhistory.htm

Answer 1

Do you know that Israel is engaged in ethnic cleansing in southern Lebanon? Israel has ordered all the villagers to clear out. Israel then destroys their homes and murders the fleeing villagers. That way there is no one to come back and nothing to which to return, making it easier for Israel to grab the territory, just as Israel has been stealing Palestine from the Palestinians.

Do you know that one-third of the Lebanese civilians murdered by Israel’s attacks on civilian residential districts are children? That is the report from Jan Egeland, the emergency relief coordinator for the UN. He says it is impossible for help to reach the wounded and those buried in rubble, because Israeli air strikes have blown up all the bridges and roads. Considering how often (almost always) Israel misses Hizbollah targets and hits civilian ones, one might think that Israeli fire is being guided by US satellites and US military GPS. Don’t be surprised at US complicity. Why would the puppet be any less evil than the puppet master?

Of course, you don’t know these things, because the US print and TV media do not report them.

Because Bush is so proud of himself, you do know that he has blocked every effort to stop the Israeli slaughter of Lebanese civilians. Bush has told the UN “NO.” Bush has told the European Community “NO.” Bush has told the pro-American Lebanese prime minister “NO.” Twice. Bush is very proud of his firmness. He is enjoying Israel’s rampage and wishes he could do the same thing in Iraq.

Does it make you a Proud American that “your” president gave Israel the green light to drop bombs on convoys of villagers fleeing from Israeli shelling, on residential neighborhoods in the capital of Beirut and throughout Lebanon, on hospitals, on power plants, on food production and storage, on ports, on civilian airports, on bridges, on roads, on every piece of infrastructure on which civilized life depends? Are you a Proud American? Or are you an Israeli puppet?

On July 20, “your” House of Representatives voted 410-8 in favor of Israel’s massive war crimes in Lebanon. Not content with making every American complicit in war crimes, “your” House of Representatives, according to the Associated Press, also “condemns enemies of the Jewish state.”

Who are the “enemies of the Jewish state”?

They are the Palestinians whose land has been stolen by the Jewish state, whose homes and olive groves have been destroyed by the Jewish state, whose children have been shot down in the streets by the Jewish state, whose women have been abused by the Jewish state. They are Palestinians who have been walled off into ghettos, who cannot reach their farm lands or medical care or schools, who cannot drive on roads through Palestine that have been constructed for Israelis only. They are Palestinians whose ancient towns have been invaded by militant Zionist “settlers” under the protection of the Israeli army who beat and persecute the Palestinians and drive them out of their towns. They are Palestinians who cannot allow their children outside their homes because they will be murdered by Israeli “settlers.”

The Palestinians who confront Israeli evil are called “terrorists.” When Bush forced free elections on Palestine, the people voted for Hamas. Hamas is the organization that has stood up to the Jewish state. This means, of course, that Hamas is evil, anti-semitic, un-American and terrorist. The US and Israel responded by cutting off all funds to the new government. Democracy is permitted only if it produces the results Bush and Israel want.


Another enemy of the Jewish state is Hizbollah. Hizbollah is a militia of Shia Muslims created in 1982 when Israel first invaded Lebanon. During this invasion the great moral Jewish state arranged for the murder of refugees in refugee camps. The result of Israel’s atrocities was Hizbollah, which fought the Israeli army, defeated it, and drove it, with its tail between its legs, out of Lebanon. Today Hizbollah not only defends southern Lebanon but also provides social services such as orphanages and medical care.

To cut to the chase, the enemies of the Jewish state are any Muslim country not ruled by an American puppet friendly to Israel. Egypt, Jordan, Saudi Arabia, and the oil emirates have sided with Israel against their own kind, because they are dependent either on American money or on American protection from their own people. Sooner or later these totally corrupt governments that do not represent the people they rule will be overthrown. It is only a matter of time.

Indeed Bush and Israel may be hastening the process in their frantic effort to overthrow the governments of Syria and Iran. Both governments have more popular support than Bush has, but the White House Moron doesn’t know this. The Moron thinks Syria and Iran will be “cakewalks” like Iraq, where ten proud divisions of the US military are tied down by a few lightly armed insurgents.

If you are still a Proud American, consider that your pride is doing nothing good for Israel or for America.

On July 20 when “your” House of Representatives, following “your” US Senate, passed the resolution in support of Israel’s war crimes, the most powerful lobby in Washington, the American Israeli Public Affairs Committee (AIPAC), quickly got out a press release proclaiming “The American people overwhelming support Israel’s war on terrorism and understand that we must stand by our closest ally in this time of crisis.”

The truth is that Israel created the crisis by invading a country with a pro-American government. The truth is that the American people do not support Israel’s war crimes, as the CNN quick poll results make clear and as was made clear by callers into C-Span.

Despite the Israeli spin on news provided by US “reporting,” a majority of Americans do not approve of Israeli atrocities against Lebanese civilians. Hizbollah is located in southern Lebanon. If Israel is targeting Hizbollah, why are Israeli bombs falling on northern Lebanon? Why are they falling on Beirut? Why are they falling on civilian airports? On schools and hospitals?

Now we arrive at the main point. When the US Senate and House of Representatives pass resolutions in support of Israeli war crimes and condemn those who resist Israeli aggression, the Senate and House confirm Osama bin Laden’s propaganda that America stands with Israel against the Arab and Muslim world.

Indeed, Israel, which has one of the world’s largest per capita incomes, is the largest recipient of US foreign aid. Many believe that much of this “aid” comes back to AIPAC, which uses it to elect “our” representatives in Congress.

This perception is no favor to Israel, whose population is declining, as the smart ones have seen the writing on the wall and have been leaving. Israel is surrounded by hundreds of millions of Muslims who are being turned into enemies of Israel by Israel’s actions and inhumane policies.

The hope in the Muslim world has always been that the United States would intervene in behalf of compromise and make Israel realize that Israel cannot steal Palestine and turn every Palestinian into a refugee.

This has been the hope of the Arab world. This is the reason our puppets have not been overthrown. This hope is the reason America still had some prestige in the Arab world.

The House of Representatives resolution, bought and paid for by AIPAC money, is the final nail in the coffin of American prestige in the Middle East. It shows that America is, indeed, Israel’s puppet, just as Osama bin Laden says, and as a majority of Muslims believe.

With hope and diplomacy dead, henceforth America and Israel have only tooth and claw. The vaunted Israeli army could not defeat a rag tag militia in southern Lebanon. The vaunted US military cannot defeat a rag tag, lightly armed, insurgency drawn from a minority of the population in Iraq, insurgents, moreover, who are mainly engaged in civil war against the Shia majority.

What will the US and its puppet master do? Both are too full of hubris and paranoia to admit their terrible mistakes. Israel and the US will either destroy from the air the civilian infrastructure of Lebanon, Palestine, Syria, and Iran so that civilized life becomes impossible for Muslims, or the US and Israel will use nuclear weapons to intimidate Muslims into acquiescence to Israel’s desires.

Muslim genocide in one form or another is the professed goal of the neoconservatives who have total control over the Bush administration. Neocon godfather Norman Podhoretz has called for World War IV (in neocon thinking WW III was the cold war) to overthrow Islam in the Middle East, deracinate the Islamic religion and turn it into a formalized, secular ritual.

Rumsfeld’s neocon Pentagon has drafted new US war doctrine that permits pre-emptive nuclear attack on non-nuclear states.

Neocon David Horowitz says that by slaughtering Palestinian and Lebanese civilians, “Israel is doing the work of the rest of the civilized world,” thus equating war criminals with civilized men.

Neocon Larry Kudlow says that “Israel is doing the Lord’s work” by murdering Lebanese, a claim that should give pause to Israel’s Christian evangelical supporters. Where does the Lord Jesus say, “go forth and murder your neighbors so that you may steal their lands”?

The complicity of the American public in these heinous crimes will damn America for all time in history.

Israel used the lame excuse of the abducted soldiers to attack Lebanon:

Did you know that Israel and the US have been planning this war against Lebanon for a year?
http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/c/a/2006/07/21/MNG2QK396D1.DTL&hw=kalman&sn=001&sc=1000
http://www.informationclearinghouse.info/article14159.htm
http://www.gnn.tv/headlines/10095/War_on_Lebanon_Planned_for_at_least_a_Year

The killing of innocent men, women and children by Israel is absurd! It delibritly attacks civillians!

Civilians killed:
1062 Lebanese (30% under 12)
44 Israeli
20 Sri Lankan (by israel)
8 Canadian (by israel)
7 Brazilian (by israel)
1 Nigerian (by israel)
1 Jordanian (by israel)
1 Chinese (by israel on UN)
1 Finnish (by israel on UN)
1 Canadian (by israel on UN)
1 Austrian (by israel on UN)

Military killed:
58 Lebanese
103 Israeli
112 Hizballah (declared)

Displaced Lebanese citizens:
~1,000,000 Lebanese
25% of total population


Israel has thousands of Arab/Muslim prisoners in it's prisons including WOMEN AND INFANTS! That's the reason why Hezbollah abducted the two Israeli soldiers: to trade them with other women and infant prisoners! If Israel agreed to Hezbollah's offer of exchanging prisoners this war could have been avoided!


Israels attacks are way beyond what is fair or reasonable, and while a group of militants did attack soldiers, Israel is attacking the civilian population which should be a human rights violation.

Israel may have had the right to target a militant headquaters or the right to send soldiers in to recapture their comrades, but once they start killing massive numbers of civilians then they have declared total war (i.e causing terror), at which point other countries have the right to come to their allies aid and fight back against Israel with military force (i.e self-defence).

Here is a list of UN resolutions that Israel has not complied. As far as I know they have ignored every single resolution.
http://www.wake-up-america.net/UN%20Resolutions%20against%20Israel.htm

The Media portrays all Arabs and Muslims as terrorists and savages just because a VERY VERY small minority are. The world seems to judge Arabs and Muslims through the actions of other misinformed and extreme religious people.

We don't generalize and say that every Priest is a child predetor just because a small minority are... The same goes for Arabs and Muslims (Not every Arab is a Muslim, not every Muslim is an Arab and not every single Arab/Muslim is a terrorist)

How would you like if you were kicked out of the house you grew up in and lost all your land that was your source of income? Would you welcome that situation with a smile and open arms? I think not. That's what happened to the Palestinians : ETHNIC CLEANSING.

re you aware that Israeli Zionists, during the 1948 war, pushed over 150,000 Palestinian refugees into the sea?

http://www.palestineremembered.com/Jaffa/Jaffa/Picture1253.html

The core issue of the conflict is ETHNIC CLEANSING (compulsory population transfer) of the Palestinian people for the past five decades. It should be emphasized that the conflict would have been at the same level of intensity, even if both warring parties had been Muslims, Christians, or even Jewish.

Since the inception of Zionism, its leaders have been keen on creating a "Jewish State" based on a "Jewish majority" by mass immigration of Jews to Palestine, primarily European Jews fleeing from anti-Semitic Tsarist Russia and Nazi Germany. When a "Jewish majority" was impossible to achieve, based on Jewish immigration and natural growth, Zionist leaders (such as Ben Gurion, Moshe Sharett, Ze'ev Jabotinsky, and Chaim Weizmann) concluded that "population transfer" was the only solution to what they referred to as the "Arab Problem." Year after year, the plan to ethnically cleanse Palestine of its indigenous people became known as the "transfer solution".

For Israelis and Zionists to excuse themselves from any war crimes, such as compulsory population transfer (Ethnic Cleansing) and dispossessing the Palestinian people, they've resorted to a myth that Palestinians left their homes, farms, businesses, banks, boats, cars, etc. based on their free will.

You have to agree that it is human nature to respond to terror with terror, and to racism with racism, these are facts that all decent people must accept and deplore simultaneously. No matter what the circumstances are (such as the urge to seek vengeance, revenge, reprisals, etc.), targeting civilians to achieve political or military objectives, in either war or non-war situations, is terrorism. It should be noted that the Palestinian people have been on the receiving end of Israeli terrorism (the chief aspect of which are the collective DISPOSSESSION and ETHNIC CLEANSING of 8.5 million Palestinians) for the past five decades. As you can see Palestinians ARE struggling agains the illeagal Israeli occupation . Palestinians living under Israeli occupation in the West Bank and Gaza suffer from closed cities, closed roads, choking of the economy, inability to visit family, loss of almost all political rights, indiscriminate confiscation of land, indiscriminate attacks, and no compensation whatsoever.

Israel has always treated arabs like second or third class ctizens, often times killing them in lage numbers if not evicting them from their homes.

here's an article that shows you just how much Israel cares about arabs
http://www.ynetnews.com/articles/0,7340,L-3278550,00.html

Here are some vary upseting statistcs that show you how Palestinians are legitmately struggling against Israel's illeagal occupation:

121 Israeli children have been killed by Palestinians and 763 Palestinian children have been killed by Israelis since September 29, 2000.

“The majority of these [Palestinian] children were killed and injured while going about normal daily activities, such as going to school, playing, shopping, or simply being in their homes. Sixty-four percent of children killed during the first six months of 2003 died as a result of Israeli air and ground attacks, or from indiscriminate fire from Israeli soldiers." - Catherine Cook

4,151 Palestinians and 1,084 Israelis have been killed since September 29, 2000.

American news reports repeatedly describe Israeli military attacks against the Palestinian population as “retaliation.” However, when one looks into the chronology of death in this conflict, the reality turns out to be quite different.


30,646 Palestinians and 7,633 Israelis
have been injured since September 29, 2000.


“With no shooting from the Palestinian side, and often little or no use of tear gas to disperse the protests, Israeli soldiers have repeatedly fired live ammunition into unarmed crowds.” - Shoot to Maim

The Israeli government and military receive $15,139,178* from the U.S. every day; Palestinian NGO’s receive $232,290** from the U.S. each day.


Israel is the target of at least 65 UN Resolutions and the Palestinians are the target of none.

Aside from the core issues—refugees, Jerusalem, borders—the major themes reflected in the U.N. resolutions against Israel over the years are its unlawful attacks on its neighbors; its violations of the human rights of the Palestinians, including deportations, demolitions of homes and other collective punishments; its confiscation of Palestinian land; its establishment of illegal settlements; and its refusal to abide by the U.N. Charter and the 1949 Fourth Geneva Convention Relative to the Protection of Civilian Persons in Time of War.
- Donald Neff

1 Israeli is being held prisoner by Palestinians, while 9,599 Palestinians are currently imprisoned by Israel.

“Since the beginning of the Israeli occupation of Palestinian territories in 1967, over 650,000 Palestinians have been detained by Israel. This forms approximately 20% of the total Palestinian population in the Occupied Palestinian Territories (OPT)." – Palestine Monitor

# of Juvenile Prisoners: 342
# of Women Prisoners: 122
# of Administrative Detention Prisoners: 775
# of Solitary Confinement Prisoners: 117

Israeli forces regularly confiscate private land; imprison individuals without process – including children – and physically abuse them under incarceration; demolish family homes; bulldoze orchards and crops; place entire towns under curfew; destroy shops and businesses; shoot, maim, and kill civilians – and Palestinians are without power to stop any of it.

When a child is arrested, for example – often by a group of armed soldiers in the middle of the night – parents can do nothing. Knowing that their son is most likely being beaten by soldiers on the way to the station, stripped and humiliated in prison, quite likely physically abused in multiple additional ways, and destined to be held – perhaps in isolation – for days, week, or months (all before a trial has even taken place), parents are without the ability to protect their child. Quite often, in fact, they cannot even visit him.

Finally, when the military trial under which their son is to be sentenced – often to years (sometimes decades) in prison – all they can do is hire a lawyer whose efforts, at best, will reduce the ultimate sentence by a few months. Rarely, if ever, can even the most skilled lawyer do more than afford the child a friendly face in court and be an outside witness to the injustice of the proceedings. Meanwhile, the presence of such a lawyer provides Israel cover for its “judicial system.”

Perhaps most significant – and rarely understood by people in the outside world – is the fact that Palestinians live, basically, in a prison in which Israel holds the keys.

They cannot leave Gaza or the West Bank unless Israeli guards allow them to. If they have been allowed out, they cannot return to their homes and families unless Israeli guards permit it.

Frequently, in both cases, Israel refuses such permission.

Academics invited to attend conferences abroad, high school students given US State Department scholarships to study in the United States, mothers wishing to visit daughters abroad, American citizens returning to their families, humanitarians bringing wheelchairs – the list goes on almost without limit – have all been denied permission by Israel to leave or enter their own land.


0 Israeli homes have been demolished by Palestinians and 4,170 Palestinian homes have been demolished by Israel since September 29, 2000.

Peter Hansen, Commissioner General of UNRWA, condemned Israel’s demolitions: “Any humanitarian looking at the sheer number of innocent civilians who have lost their homes can only condemn Israel’s house demolition policy as a hugely disproportionate military response by an occupation army... It is a policy that creates only hardship and bitterness, and in the end can only undermine hope for future reconciliation and peace.”


The Israeli unemployment rate is 8.9%, while the Palestinian unemployment rate is estimated at 25-31%.

“The West Bank and Gaza have absorbed levels of unemployment that would have torn the social fabric in many other societies.” - World Bank

60+ new Jewish-only settlements have been built by the Israeli government on confiscated Palestinian land between March 2001 and July 11, 2003.

“The Occupying Power shall not deport or transfer parts of its own civilian population into the territory it occupies.”
- Article 49 of the Fourth Geneva Convention of 1949

Who's the terrorist?

Israel is the terrorist.

Please visit the websites i included in the souce list, especially the websites http://www.fromisraeltolebanon.com/ , http://www.palestineremembered.com/ , http://www.ifamericansknew.org/ and http://www.wake-up-america.net/ to learn more about the current situation in Palestine and Lebanon.

Do your own research and don't let the media spoonfeed you or brainwash you with pro-zionist and anti-Arab/Islam propaganda!


The Lebanese and Palestinians are figthing for what is truly theirs. Israel and the US are the terrorist that do anything that will push their own personal and political agenda regardless of how many people die.

Answer 2

After almost 60 years of occupation and oppression, I think that Palestinians earned their right to fight back and in ANY WAY possible!!

Of course this applies to Lebanon too!!

Terrorism is Israel and the US government and the people who think that Palestinians don't have a country!! So they're called Palestinians because of their hair color??!!!

How stupid and arrogant some people can be but these idiots can be rest assured that just causes can not be forgotten and oppressed people can not be silenced even with NUKES!!

HendryDoso: To fill you in, I say this:
How about I take your house and your land and then "say" that i will give you back the cellar only to block air, light, guests, and even your movements!! How would you feel? According to your logic, i can do that and you should be happy...So your address please!!!

Golan height are still occupied by the way!!

Answer 3

Hezbollah is not a the Lebanese. It would be like if David Koresh and the Branch Devidians attacked Mexico and Mexico said the United States attacked them. The problem is that the Lebanese government has done nothing to stop Hezbollah. If the US would have done nothing to stop Branch Devidians and they kept attacking Mexico eventually Mexico would attack the US to protect itself. Palestinians are, for the most part the same. If Palestine would attack Israel you could say it was a war of two nations but it is not officially Palestine but terrorist groups within Palestine. They hide behind civilians and are not authorized by the government of Palestine. They also ask for land and when Israel gave back the Gaza Strip these terrorist groups used it to strike Israel. If Palestinians do not want occupation from Israel they must control their citizens. If they do not they will eventually be aided in controlling their citizens hence the occupation. Israel is only defending not attacking.

Answer 4

No, if anything the Lebanese need to fight against Syrian occupation and Iranian influence. The Syrians have only raped Lebanon and robbed that country of its own right of self-detrmination. Remember Israel withdrew from Lebanon in 2000. Israel has played fair. It was Hezbollah who made the first strike in this current war, they are only reaping what they have sown.

And Israel has said time and time again to the Palestinians that if they would abandon terror and act like a civilized nation they would be willing to have peace talks. Don't forget either, that in 1948 when the nation of modern Israel was created, Palestinians had the chance to create their own state, but they did not. They, along with the Arab world adopted the "all or nothing" doctrine. Well time after time they give all and get nothing.

And unfortuanly the radical Islamists have used the flag of religon to dupe their uneducated masses into thinking that they actually are acting in the name of Allah, when in reality they are only acting on behalf of selfish, power hungry despots.

Answer 5

Of course its a legitimate struggle against occupation.
israel is occupying Palestinian,Lebanese&syrian land,they r invaders and they have to be resisted!!!
Any free man will fight to free his land with any means he can.
istead of asking them to stop fighting the occupation,ask the occupiers(israel) to give the land back and all that will end.

Answer 6

Yes, not only these countries but any other Muslim country.If Muslims decided to defend their faith, country ,Honor then they are terrorists. On the other hand, if an evil regime like that of the Yankee or of the Jews then it is self defense..! Amazes me such concept.
Long Live Victorious Hezb Allah

Answer 7

I'll admit to being ignorant in this area, but didn't Israel make the desicion to pull out of the Gaza Strip, the Golan Hights? And faced with neighbors who freely claim that their goal in the immediate future is the complete iradication of them as a people, wouldn't they be obligated as humans to react? I'm speaking honestly that I don't know the whole story of this fight, so fill me in.

Answer 8

Precisely

Answer 9

The Israelis are responsible for this....They are, and have been commiting acts of terror on the Palestinians and other Arabs for generations. It is not only their right to fight back against the aggressor, the occupier, it is their duty....

Answer 10

ofcourse it's thier right 2 defend thier land against enemies.wat would u do if u were n thier shoes?u'd definitely struggle 2 save ur family and ur country

Answer 11

As long as they abide by the rules of war, it is legitimate. If they break the rules of war and target civilians or execute/torture prisoners, then it devolves into terrorism.