Why do "pro-choice" people think that murder is such a great alternative?

Question

to taking responsibility for your own actions? "Gee I just couldn't keep my legs closed and now I'm pregnant and the guy(s) I slept with while very cute and good in bed wouldn't hand his own mother a glass of water if she was drowning. Oh well I'll just go down to planned parenthood and have them kill it for me." Ain't love grand?!?!?

Let me dispel a myth for you. Pro-life is not about women's rights. That’s right it is about deciding whether a life is any less precious because they are in the early stages of development. It is about speaking for the child in question. Should this life be snuffed out because someone made a bad choice? No yes in cases like Ananke talks about where the pregnancy is "tubular" or in cases or incest or rape it should be up to the woman. Otherwise you will just have to take responsibility (I know a dirty word) for your actions. And men should not be exempt from this you make a baby and it is your responsibility (there's that word again) to help raise it. We all have limitations on what we can do with our bodies: we can’t pump them full of cocaine, we can’t use our hands to hit someone, we can’t fill them full of beer and get behind the wheel (or if we do we will face the consequences). So control has nothing to do with it just who gets to live.

Answer 1

That's not why I support a right to choose. I support it because it is going to go on anyway, and in just as big numbers. And far more dangerously. The very idea that you can ban abortion and it will magically cease is a gd JOKE. The whole point of trying to end it is to force people to do what other people believe. It is a control issue. Banning legal abortions would be a disaster and as the teenage girls begin to die from botched procedures, people will begin to see that......too late.

Answer 2

This question just keeps coming up in various forms. As a liberal, this is how I feel about abortion:

**I'm against abortion as a form of birth control. I don't think people who get pregnant because they failed to properly protect themselves should not get abortions. But is that their call or mine?

**I believe children who are victims of rape/incest should be allowed the choice of an abortion. After being raped (sometimes by a father or other family member), I don't think it is morally right to force an underage female to carry a child that resulted from such.

**I believe women who are victims of rape should be allowed the choice of an abortion. Although I'm not personally sure if I would chose abortion, I've seen enough victims to know that the mental and physical stress of carrying a child that resulted from rape is pretty severe.

**I believe a woman should be allowed the choice of an abortion in the instance that her life is put in jeopardy by birthing the baby.

The problem with banning abortion, but allowing exceptions in the above circumstances is that I have not heard any realistic way to do it. How do you prove that is the reason? What if a young woman is date raped and finds she is pregnant and decides she doesn't want the baby? A lot of those cases are he said/she said. What if he says, "I didn't do it?" Does she have to carry the baby? There are just too many issues. And then you will have women saying they were raped so they can get abortions. That opens up a whole new can of worms. Do you hold that against women with legitimate cases?

I think it's a decision that's very hard to make. Until someone can convince me that all these problems can be addressed, I can't agree to ban abortion. Do you have any suggestions?

I have another comment, too, which is by no means an argument, but...I have personally known of two instances (a couple of years apart) in which male Republicans, staunch pro-lifers, got women pregnant. The first guy got his girlfriend pregnant. They had no marriage plans and he was thinking of breaking up with her anyway. His first question was, "Is it mine?" (Yeah, that's going to make you want his baby.) His second question was, "What are YOU going to do with IT?" She got an abortion. Second situation was a casual relationship. The same two questions were asked. She had the baby, but the guy is nowhere to be seen. So, a lot of people (men in particular) are all cheerful about being pro-lifers until faced with an actual situation. Then all of a sudden, the baby becomes "it" and becomes the woman's problem.

I like your "Gee I couldn't keep my legs closed..." speech--why don't you repeat that to some rape victimes? I'm sure they would appreciate it, too.

I agree, too, that making abortion illegal is not going to stop it. We'll be back to the old hanger process or worse. Or you'll have doctors doing the procedure in unsafe conditions.

Answer 3

I do not see the right to choose as a form of birth control for casual sex, and I highly doubt that many do. First of all, it is a medical procedure, which I am sure will cost you a kidney just to pay for it. It's cheaper to by the pill (which, by the way, insurance doesn't cover. . . But they will cover Viagra. Little one-sided, isn't it??).

You won't stop it by making it illegal (for proof, I will refer you to drugs, teen smoking, teen drinking, DUI's, homicide, rape, etc.). All you will do is take the regulation out of it, and people will die from having illegal abortions. No matter what you say, the ones that choose to have an abortion will have one - like it or not.

The reason I support the right to choose is that women don't choose to be raped, and in some of those cases, they get pregnant. And there are cases of molestation, incest, and people that shouldn't even have children. In these cases, I think the woman (or girl in some cases) should have the right not to carry the pregnancy to term. I think that would be horrible to make someone relive such abuse everyday for 9 months. I don't think I could do so in such a case - that would take someone close to sainthood to do.

I think that you have the right not to support abortion. And you have the right not to have one (which should be easy, since you can't even get pregnant). But I do not think you have the right to impose your beliefs on others. If you don't like it fine. Carry a sign if you want to. Sing it from the roof tops as well. But taking the right to choose away because YOU don't support it would be like me taking your right to express your thoughts because I don't like what you are saying. In the end, it all comes down to your rights ending where someone elses begin.

Answer 4

Sometimes taking responsibility is going to the planned parenthood clinic. You can't murder a ball of cells and if you could anyone who has scratched multiple misquito bites is a serial killer.

Conservatives are really great. Sanctity of life?
Yeah as long as your a fetus and not an Iraqi kid.

You say life begins at conception. I say life began a billion years ago and it's a continuous process.

Condoms break, accidents happen and sorry but the same people who are "pro-life" are usually pro-death penalty and you people sound ridiculous talking about murder.

Murder is what happens when you hook a guys nuts up to a car battery when you're "sure" he's guilty and then later find out he's not. Thats real murder done in my name with my tax money.

Answer 5

Abortion is probably the most incendiary topic you can discuss here (or in any forum). I'm always interested in how these difficult issues are "discussed". Actually, they are rarely "discussed" but rather the dialog becomes a pose-off of extreme anecdotal examples chosen to make one side look ridiculous, and the other morally superior.

Take for example gun control:

Pro: "yahoos with a house full of guns are putting their 3 year-old's lives at risk".

Con: "when an intruder comes into my home intent on raping and murdering my wife, I want to be able to defend my family".

Reality is somewhere nearer the threshold, equidistant from those extreme examples.

And so it is with abortion. It's not always "baby murder" committed by an irresponsible woman for her own convenience. Nor is it's control a reprehensible assault on the sacred right to privacy and control over one's own body.

The state has a rightful interest and obligation to protect the lives of innocents who cannot protect themselves. And yet in some circumstances, a woman has no other reasonable choice.

And ALWAYS...it's an imperfect decision.

To those on the opposite side of this issue from me (I'm pro-life) I say...meet me at the threshold and let's talk for a while. At least we'll better understand one another.

Answer 6

You work on the presumption that abortion is murder.

I think the main problem between Pro-Life and Pro-Choice is they have different definitions of what a person is.

For starters, most people believed that life (and thus a person) started when you took your first breath out of the womb. That's is literally what soul means, the breath of life. It wasn't until recently that some people decided to change that definition.

I don't think something like this should be legislated, because of the ambiguity about what it means to be a person. Technically I can call a child, in utero, a parasite. Because of this vagueness and necessary call to ones beliefs, I think leaving it up to the individual is best.

My sister had a good line. I'm Pro-choice for everyone, but Pro-Life for me. I think everyone can learn something from her.

Answer 7

What about the 10 year old raped by her uncle who can neither physically nor mentally handle a birth? The tubal pregnancy that will kill the mother loooong before the child is viable?

Yes, sluts should have to keep their children til term, and learn to keep the legs closed. But they aren't the only ones out there that needed a choice.

And men's rights.... totally for them. If you want the child when it's born, if you want it born then adopted out that's fine. I think you should have that choice. But when you make that choice, you have to live with it just like the mother. You have to pay for medical treatments during pregnancy.

I for one would never have an abortion. It's not right. I have religious beliefs that conflict with it. But in America, our laws are made to protect all people, not just my faith. And I will stand up for anyone's right to exercise their own way of life!

Answer 8

It's called "pro-choice", not "pro-abortion". Many women who would never get an abortion themselves recognize that it's up to every woman to make her OWN choice.

I also see the side of pro-life, although...where do pro-lifers draw the line? Are all pro-lifers vegan or at least vegetarian? Don't answer now. But I'd love it if everyone would ponder this thought.

To your comment about responsibility: both man and woman were there during conception. Both should take responsibility equally. It's not her "fault" any more than it is his.

Answer 9

Abortion should be legal... it is the womans choice to abort a baby... I do think that abortion should NOT be used as a form of birth control but why have the child grow up in a bad environment. Also has someone said earlier even if abortion was outlawed it would still continue... the same way the use of drugs continues despite the fact that they are illegal.

Answer 10

no, the alternative i fear is in el salvador. where abortion is illegal. and every year women risk their life and fertility getting them. not with coat hangers so much anymore, but by seeking the pills that we use here to induce miscarriages. bought over the internet in mysterious dosages, to tear apart their insides.

and then the police find them, when they don't turn up for work for a few days because they sweat in bed with a fever. and then they take these girls away, to bleed in a jail cell and be felt up by doctors, and their friends are forced to testify against them. and sometimes, they aren't even successful and give birth to poor babies with horrific defects from the chemicals.

please, it is not that yours is not the superior moral choice. it is that, like all things the government will have to do something about enforcement under your suggestion. and i fear their intrusions already, even before my body becomes a crime scene and i have no right to it whatsoever. tell me how this would not be the form our enforcement would also take?

i proved to you that the pro-choice stance is about the government's abilities and what i am willing to trust them with. it isn't women's rights. i do not trust them to prevent abortions when they never could before. what will happen to women who seek them out ethan? spell it out. how long should they go to prison? you said yourself that they made the choice when they had sex, didn't they? and it's still something you'll never face. unless you're a virgin, you don't know how many kids you haven't had do you?

i still think your solution entails worse things than what we have now. you don't care what happens to these women. you say you're afraid of socialism? that's what you advocate when you declare someone the property of the community, a vessel of life too important to make her own decisions. and however well intentioned you think it is, it is still abhorrent. it isn't freedom.