Am I the only one that cringes when someone talks about the "theory" of Evolution?

Question

I mean you get these questions from people who, apparently, dropped out of school in grade 4 who seem to think that since Evolution is a "theory", it's not based on facts.
To be honest, It really get's me down. The idea that someone's education was so lacking that they don't even know that Evolution, like ALL other Science, is a Theorem. And when you point out that Gravity, Thermodynamics, Relativity are all THEORIES, they don't believe you.
The ignorance is, quite frankly, staggering.
Just for those of you who don't seem to understand, let me spell it out for you. Gravity is a THEORY. There is ONE "law" of gravity and that is Newton's Law of Gravity. Did you get that? HIS law. He wrote it. However, it is far from widely accepted. Scientists still debate the actual forces behind gravity. Yet the fact that gravity exists is not debated.
The same thing goes for Evolution. No scientist debates that it occurs, only how it occurs is debated.
Understand now?
(sigh, probably not...)

Oh and before you point out that "Dr." Ken Hovind disputes the truth of Evolution, you should do your homework and read how his "doctorate" came from a diploma mill. He is no more a doctor than a Galapagos Finch is President.

Mlaheji,
"any proof" is not a complete sentence. Can you please go back to elementary school and get some English lessons, then come back and ask a question like a grown-up? Maybe then we can talk. Deal?

Wildwilson,
We KNOW where Ken got his degree. The "university" where Kent Hovind received his alleged doctorate:

PATRIOT UNIVERSITY
6915 Palmer Park Boulevard Colorado Springs, Colorado 80915 [phone]
"Claiming to be a ministry of Hilltop Baptist Church, the college charges between $15 and $32 per credit and offers degrees through the doctoral level. Their catalog contains no information on the school's faculty or their credentials. Patriot claims accreditation by the American Accrediting Association of Theological Institutions (see Chapter 3), an accrediting mill associated with Christian Bible College in Rocky Mount, North Carolina. Advertises or has advertised in Pulpit Helps."

Did you get all that? Patriot university, has NO campus, NO classes and NO correspondence courses. It is a diploma mill. And the diplomas, like Kent's credentials, aren't worth the toilet paper it's printed on.
As for your asinine assertation about Macroevolution, please read something credible.

Well thanks for that Kevin Arnold, Um, did you take your medication today? Or is your tin-foil hat on too tight.
In either case it's always nice to hear from your crowd, it makes the rest of us very thankful not to be you....

Answer 1

I don't know where to start. I have faced this situation countless times. I live in a mostly religious community and I have gotten into debates over evolution more than my heart's beaten in the last five years (now I just walk out of the room whenever the topic comes up).

What I can tell you is that you need to patient. Many people as you say don't have high school diplomas and act like they have Ph.D's from Harvard when they talk about evolution. Instead of getting angry with these people, pity them, pity the way they are led to believe such lies so strongly. I really do feel sorry for them myself. I suggest you do the same because very very few people can be convinced that everything they've believed in their whole lives is a lie. It would just be pointless to waste your time on preaching science.

What I think you should do is research the reasons why some believe evolution to be a false theory, then debunk them (or find a site that does) one by one if they get into a debate with you again. Don't expect them to hit their heads and cry "oh gosh I've been so blind, you are so right." You won't get that (no harm in daydreaming though) but your words will arouse doubt. A little voice inside (logic) will start speaking up. Soon they will go and research evolution for themselves and believe me, the way most people are convinced is when they do the convincing themselves. All you need to do is plant the doubts inside.

On another note, you should realize we are now entering a new Age of Reason. Just like 2,000 years ago people started refusing the pagan religions and embraced christainity, more and more people now are refusing the lies they've been fed since they were babies and embracing science. We are waking up. And it's people like you that will ensure that, not too long from now, religion will become a kids' fairy tale.

Answer 2

My, my, my, here we go again. As a practicing Catholic (yes, we are Christians, too) and a registered professional geologist, I have no problem with evolution as a theory and as a science. Nor do many of my PhD colleagues.

Evolution is science, not religious dogma. Nor is evolution a replacement for religious beliefs. Science, for example, can explain the birth process from conception to delivery. But science cannot and will never be able to explain when this new developing person receives their spirituality, their soul. Science is incapable of explaining a dogmatic belief.

Many anti-evolutionists talk about the “fossil records” without truly understanding what fossils really are. A fossil is an impression or cast of what once was there. It is composed of its host rock. How much detail is preserved depends on the grain size and matrix of the rock. Plus many more factors. Do you know how hard it is to produce a fossil? Conditions have to be exact. Soft tissue impressions are exceedingly difficult to preserve. But, exquisite specimens do exist. Is there a complete fossil record? Yes, but we haven’t found all of it yet.

How about “transition fossils”? How would we recognize them? Some grotesquely deformed animal? No, fact is all fossils are “transition” fossils. We, someday, will be “transition” fossils. Genetics are fast, evolution is very slow. Some modern day animals, like the horseshoe crab, haven’t changed in thousands of years. Why? No need to.

Parts of Darwin’s theory have been disproven and/or replaced. This is how science works. Try to disprove, improve or replace the ideas of others. But for when it was written, Darwin’s theory is still a remarkable work of science.

In Pennsylvania, a highly publicized court battle took place at the end of 2005 where the Dover Area School Board tried to introduce Intelligent Design (a.k.a. Creation Science) as a science in 9th grade biology. I have just read the court’s ruling. Judge Jones did a remarkable job, well worth reading the 139 pages. (Intelligent Design is not science.) The link to the ruling is below.

To get an understanding of evolution and how it works, I recommend everyone start at the beginning. Take some geology courses, specifically historical geology, paleontology, and paleobotany. The puzzle pieces fit together…………

Answer 3

I don't see what the problem is. EVERYTHING IN SCIENCE IS A THEORY. People who don't understand what a theory is or what theory means throw it around like it's a bad term and we don't know what we're talking about because it's theory and not fact.

You're completely right. It's too bad that majority of this debate is based on ignorance.

Ever had this debate with a real scientist or even someone who isn't a scientist but can do things like addition and subtraction? Thats fun. Although nothing usually gets resolved at least the argument is interesting and you get some perspective. Although when God makes it's way into the argument...it gets boring because that means I win because the person couldn't come up with a reasonable argument.


Patriot university doesn't have any faculty either.

Answer 4

At this point Evolution is not a Working Theory like Gravity or Relativity in that we cannot do anything with it. There are no models that account for the evolution of many complex systems. Until the hundreds of systems with thousands of necessary parts that would have to evolve separately and fall into place, or gain some intermediate advantage as junk parts, or until some portion of the "theoretical" scaffolding that "fell away once it was no longer needed" is found, then evolution is a theory that is in serious trouble. It is true that there is a link between the forms of life on Earth, it is true that much of the DNA in all species is the same. However evolution postulates that "Natural Selection" alone accounts for the diversity of this interlinked tree, and it just cannot account for things evolving through intermediate steps that do not offer any advantage at best, and represent a dangerous vulnerability and cost of energy at worst until they are complete and functional after a thousand mutations. Sorry to rain on your parade, but your kind of smug confidence in the Theory is really the ignorance that I cringe at.

There is a promising possibility in Quantum "Many Worlds" theory that accounts for rapid development of adaptations and systems and life itself, it is the theory that the possibility of life and the various solutions and adaptations must exist in some quantum state, and since they resist entropy once the information is exchanged with our state through quantum interference it becomes stable and preferred. This would tend to drive speciation at the upper limit of its probability for all life, which accounts for what we see happening in the fossil record while evolution by Natural Selection does not. No need for the hand of God if that offends, but this 'Quantum Information Exchange' is a good place to take a fresh look at a problem you seem to think is solved.

Answer 5

I think you are misled and are incorrect in your beliefs. Don't believe something just because the government wants you to. Evolution is an impossibility. DNA cannot mutate to create something new, all mutation can do is **** up something in the process (like cause the result to be an extra foot or eye, etc.) To think that through some other evolutionary hypothesis basis, that any being could change and alter (beyond minor genetic adaptation), is to think a falsehood to be true. In the cambrian period of history (the earliest period of time that fossil remains have been discovered from), there were sea horse and snail creatures with the EXACT same body structures and genetic credentials as their descendants of today. Fossil records prove this. Also, do not believe that humans came from monkey because that is a farce that the Illuminati and Freemason devil-worshipping pieces of garbage want you to believe. They found skulls from different periods of time and arranged them in such a way as to make it look very convincing but in all reality, they just arranged different shaped skulls to suit the theory. No skull is the exact same size as another. . . therefore one cannot say that the evolution chart is a credible source of proof for the THEORY of evolution. There have actually been many scientists who have proven wrong many aspects of Evolution, especially concerning the book "origin of species, by means of natural selection". Charles Darwin was a smart man no doubt but his theoretical analysis on the possibility of Evolution being the origin of our species is incorrect. I believe that you should watch a video hovering around Kazaa (download KazaaLite, its somewhere on the internet available for download) and it is called, "The collapse of evolution". . . if it says michael moore it isnt by him, download that one though because I have that version and it works great. The video is religious in parts but very informative. Also many facts are available on the internet contradicting hypothetical information regarding Evolution. Anyways, In closing, I hope that you reconsider your beliefs. Have a good day,
Kevin Arnold.

Answer 6

Keep in mind that the popular usage of the word "theory" is different than the scientific one.

"The theory of evolution is much more than just a "theory." The word "theory" in normal usage means a guess or a hunch. But in science, a "theory" is a belief that has been verified by actual experimentation and/or observation.

Most biologists believe that evolution is more than a theory; it is an established fact. The earth's life forms have evolved over billions of years. Species of animals have been recently observed as continuing to evolve, both in the lab and field.

There remains debate about some details of past evolution. For example, there is a consensus that dinosaurs evolved and that birds evolved; there is some debate as to whether dinosaurs were the distant ancestors of birds. "

Answer 7

How did the experts that you talked to become expert. Do they have science degrees? I just wonder if getting those science degrees did they ever cheat on a test. If they ever cheated on a test then they do not have much credibility do they. So how can you trust a science expert to tell you the truth about something that you do not know. I want you to consider a beaver. As far as I know they are the only animal that can constuct a dam besides humans. According to evolution their flat tails would have been a mutation. Did the beaver that had a mutated flat tail think wow I have a flat tail. What can I do with this? I will use it to build a dam with. God made beavers fully equipt to do what they needed to do. They did not mutate from something else cause nothing else has instincts or knowledge to do what they do. There are plenty more examples of what I can tell you. The thing for you to do is stop listening to these lying experts. They can not prove nothing they can only speculate. I have been speculating with them for years.

Answer 8

The amount of ignorance is staggering. But people aren't fighting because they don't know, it's because they don't want to know. They're fighting because science is threatening their way of life, and the sadistic institutions that control their lives (i.e. the clergy).

It's a widely known FACT that the church wishes to recapture the control it is losing. More and more people are discontent with the church and are quitting it, and then there's the generation of "rational thinking" that would rather think in scientific (logical) terms, than in something that is absolutely absurd.

And as the battle intensifies, the rift will become larger, the fundies will become more fundamentalist, isolationist and desperate, and the rational thinkers will win, because let's face it, there's more of us than there's of them.

It's a matter of politics now, not of personal choice. As long as fundi supporting congressmen, women and presidents are elected, their movement will remain alive since they will have lawmaker support.

The american taliban, some call it.


TO KEVIN ARNOLD: OH PLEASE, "genetic credentials"?... from a fossil.... SERIOUSLY! WHERE DO YOU GET YOUR INFO! Come on...

Answer 9

Well I don't have a long answer to contribute, nor do I have time to sit here and read all these long answers but I completely agree with you. People who disagree with evolution are usually uneducated in science. A major flag for this is when they say that evolution means that we came from monkeys or that we kill babies for stem cells. It's pretty tragic that in general people are so misinformed when it comes to science. Evolution is a fact. The jury is out. Period. In fact it is happening before our very eyes if you read the article listed below. Basically the same finches that Darwin studied on the Gallapagos islands have evolved a smaller beak just 2 decades after the introduction of a new food source.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20060714/ap_on_sc/darwin_evolution;_ylt=Aic3zUcfOY2HOmaLb.YADp.s0NUE;_ylu=X3oDMTA3MzV0MTdmBHNlYwM3NTM-

Answer 10

I completely and utterly agree...

It doesn't matter how many times you try and explain to the creationist fools how science works they seem completely unable to understand what a theory is, and endlessly carp on about how evolution is "just a theory". You're point is well made...

I keep telling myself, "don't look at the religion and spirituality" category... they are simply not interested in understanding... and then they come and post here in Biology and it winds me up so much I end up making yet another pointless attempt to bring some knowledge into their lives...

If they can't even understand the scientific method, they have no hope of actually being able to evaluate the evidence... although of course, the source of all evidence is ye olde holy Bible (groan)...

Rant, rant, rant... sorry - you reminded me of how much this annoys me!