Do you think there is a possibility of genuine tragedy in the world?

Question

Consider the death of a child. Some say God will not allow a child to go to hell, so ultimately there is no genuine tragedy when a child suffers or dies because, like most Hollywood movies, you can count on an ultimate happy ending (the child lives happily ever-after in heaven). If those who mourn the child eventually go to heaven, then they will be happily reunited with the child, and so in the long run there is no tragedy for them either. So what about an adult who goes to hell? Some folks say this is no tragedy because only those who rebel against God end up in hell, and they deserve their fate. There are also New Age spiritual ideas that view the world in terms of ultimate perfection, so for them – just like the Christians – there does not seem to be any genuine tragedy. The world is ultimately a sort of game in which you suffer in the process of growth, but eventually everything works out for the best. When everything works out for the best, it is not a tragedy, but a comedy.

So in light of these ideas, I repeat my question: Is there genuine tragedy in the world? If so, does this mean that the universe is not perfect? But if the universe is not perfect, then on what basis do we judge its imperfections? The universe is the totality of all that there is, so we can’t step outside of it and judge it by some external standard. And for those of you who believe in a perfect God, I would ask: Do you think God’s creation is something less than the best of all possible worlds? In short, did God create a cosmic comedy, or did he allow for the possibility of genuine tragedy?

Baraaa: The sort of situation I have in mind is suffering that is severe and ultimately pointless. If we are truly nothing more than globs of animated meat that sprung from the earth for not reason, and if there is ultimately no afterlife, then a life of severe suffering is genuinely tragic – it is pointless suffering that ends in oblivion. It is suffering with “no redeeming value” so to speak. I’m trying to distinguish this from situations that only SEEM tragic from some limited perspective. Think of someone who loses his job and becomes depressed to the point of near suicidal for a few weeks, then discovers that the loss of the job was actually an opportunity for something even better. The suffering and pain were real at the time, but looking back on it from a later perspective, it was just a necessary period of turmoil leading to a greater good.

Concerning the “perfection of the universe” my point was that (as I see it) a perfect universe should not contain any genuine tragedy. So either the universe is not perfect (which is my view) or there is no genuine tragedy (which, I think, is the implication of many traditional religious views). As for your comment about arguing just for the sake of arguing, I would say this: A major task of philosophy is bringing the implications of our beliefs more clearly to light. Without realizing it, we often hold contradictory beliefs. Philosophy can help bring these contradictions to consciousness, so we can deal with them, either by changing our beliefs to resolve the contradiction, or by consciously embracing the contradictions and just living with them. My guess is that most Christians don’t know how to reconcile the ideas of a perfect God as the creator of a world full of genuine tragedy, so they chose to ignore it and just say something like “God works in mysterious ways.”

Hiileo: If the universe is already perfect, then ultimately the tragedy IS dissipated because our lives are meaningful and our suffering ultimately leads us to our greater good. Suffering in the process of growth toward some greater joy or meaning is just “leaning experience” not genuine tragedy in the long run. This does not minimize the pain or deep sadness during the moments of suffering, but it does trivialize it to some extent, once we consider “the big picture.” But notice that I am NOT in favor of this. I’m arguing AGAINST those who trivialize suffering when they say that God will make sure that everything comes out good in the end. I am NOT convinced that everything is guaranteed to come out ok in the end. I think that the Creator evolves with the creation, and it is really up to us to avoid ultimate tragedy by CREATING a perfect universe. If we fail in this task, then there will be ultimate tragedy, but at the moment that is no guarantee one way or the other.

Answer 1

These are some very profound observations...and to some extent; you answered your own question. I wrote volumes and volumes on these very subjects; and addressed some of the very same areas. I took it a step further and acknowledged all suffering and grief. It is all quite real.

I also shared (with a very disenfranchised group of people) there isn't any Hell, because we are working it all out right where we are. This is simplistic of course, but I reached out to literal and simpler minds. I felt that the largest danger we face as a society is in the belief that any one of us is condemned to an eternal Hell; for what would be their impetus to do better?

This simple philosophy stuck with my targeted audience and generated some phenomenal feedback...and although it is a rather large assumption; I hope I saved a few lives in the process. I will spare you the reasoning I used in my argument, but the upshot was in acknowledgment, forgiveness, and understanding.

I know I turned my whole life around the minute I embraced what I perceive as the Good in Life. People get hung up on labels...call it God, the Higher Power; The Source...whatever you prefer. It doesn't mean anything bad ever happens to me...it just makes it more bearable...because I know it is leading to a purpose. I have worked very hard on acceptance of a Divine Law I barely comprehend. I have many theories...but space and time won't permit us to explore all of them in this writing.

I have witnessed many wondrous things...things with no simple explanation. When you explore yourself from deep within; it paves the way for more knowledge and deeper understanding. How do you explain a woman who gets run over by a three ton steam roller and lives to tell about it; while a young man gets killed with a stray rock from underneath his motorcycle and it hits him in the only opening in his helmet and kills him instantly? These things really happened.

We aren't meant to always know "Why?"...and this is where faith comes in. Our conscious thoughts seem to shape our experiences...and those around us. We are interconnected in ways that become almost unfathomable. We are participating in Creation even as we speak.

I have also explored Karma, the ideology of choices made before we are born (as spirits), and multiple religious philosophies. It all seems to lead back to the same place...we are governed by Universal Laws that transcend all divisive barriers. So the real question is not in "Do we suffer?" but rather "Why do we suffer?" and do we contribute to this suffering? ...And most importantly, "How do we change it?"

The buck stops here. I will never deliberately hurt another living soul. What if everyone did the same? Think of the possible consequences of such a phenomena and the serious reduction in harm this would generate. A worthy thought, indeed. Peace be with you.

Answer 2

There is no genuine tragedy as the one you've depicted. But there are ironies and poetic tragedies. Irony is a state of affairs that is the reverse of what was to be expected; a result opposite to and in mockery of the appropriate result. For instance: A diabetic, on their way to buy insulin, is killed by a runaway truck. They are the victim of an accident. If the truck was delivering sugar, they were the victim of an oddly poetic coincidence. But if the truck was delivering insulin, ah! Then they are the victim of irony. Romeo and Juliet was a tragedy although in the end, the were able to die in each others arms(or next to each other.) But that is a dark happy ending. So a great, genuine tragedy would be this: A man has done everything good he can possibly do in his life. One day he dies, but God just doesn't feel like letting him into heaven, no actual reason, God just doesn't see him as ready to enter heaven. Instead God sends him back to live because he decides that there are not enough people who do enough good thing. But this guy has lived his life, he's ready to go into nirvana, and have total bliss. But instead he has to work more. But the man doesn't feel like it, instead he feels somewhat screwed over by God and he doesn't do anything good. Rather, he changes and becomes a total different man. That is a tragedy, because God let it happen. But God won't let that happen so then it will never become a "genuine tragedy."

Answer 3

You forgot to define tragedy here. And what is a "genuine tragedy" as opposed to "fake tragedgy??????"

Just to make it short, if we experience something, then it is genuine. Whether that is true or not we may never know. And when somebody loses a child or baby, it is a tragedy even if they're going to heaven, because they will no longer be able to hold them, talk to them, kiss them, tell them stories, feel proud of them in this life. It is a tragedy because it is taking something away us, the need to feel those feelings, and that is totally unselfish and natural. So from that perspective yes it is a tragedy.

As for the universe being perfect or not, can u make a better universe urself? Can u make the sun come out of the west instead of the east? I'm not into the arguing for the sake of arguments. End of story.

Answer 4

I think I understand your question: Is their any undeserved tragedy? Undeserved, no. As a Christian I believe that every man or woman has a choice for his or her fate. I believe that the ultimate tragedy is when a person, does not have the spiritual needs he feels clarified by the sharing of the gospel, and he then turns away from the voice of God and receives eternal punishment. However, this man or woman did have a choice. I believe that God is a loving God and is willing to perfect any person that will come to Him. But, it is His perfection that forces Him to be just, giving punishment to the unrelenting and salvation to those that will accept the way in which it must come to them.

I do not think that in any way God looks upon the world as a master comedy. I believe that God (as Jesus Christ) suffered and gave his life as a human to give the possibility of salvation from punishment. The point is valid, but without base. If God created us with that view then He would have given no self sacrifice to save us.

This was a very good, thought provoking, question. If you want to know more about why I believe what I do ask another question. I will try to look out for it.

Answer 5

A child dying seems enough tragedy for me. Minimizing that tragedy with the idea that the child is going to heaven is naiive. We are merely animals of this earth and to say that going to heaven dissipates tragedy is foolish. This question is lame. Because we have emotions, tragedy exists. Our feelings create tragedy and comedy. All we truely know is this life. Beyond life, no one can genuinely tell you the truth. A child not being able to live out and experience the joys of life is the real tragedy, to not even have a chance when so many others have. Don't you understand?

Answer 6

I think the biggest tragedy is that by biblical terms, there is no such thing as a christian. There can't be. By saying you are a christian you have already judged everyone else as being inferior to yourself. By that judgement you violate biblical teachings, therefore could not be a christian.

Matthew
7:1 Judge not, that ye be not judged.

Any death is tragic from an emotional standpoint. Not just with humans, either. Many kinds of animals experience the same emotional pain when their offspring dies. It is more apparent with more intelligent species, of course.

Only the dead know what comes after death. No living person has that knowledge, nor could. Therefore death is tragic. If you look at it that way then life itself is tragic.

Answer 7

We, as spiritual beings trapped in the flesh ("spirits in the material world"), are on an evolutionary path back to Oneness with the original Creative Force, which is God. If the universe is imperfect, its the same imperfectness that exists in say, the artwork that children bring home from pre-school. Still cherished and loved for all its imperfections by a doting Parent. Having said all that, then, the real tragedy in the world is that we as spiritual entities never complete our soul journey/evolution back to Oneness with God, and remain here, trapped in the flesh, in matter, forever.

Answer 8

Everyday when I turn on my television, or read the daily newspapers or listen to the radio, I hear genuine tragedy. I hear from others, some friends and acquaintances, who have some stories of dismay. I believe that much of what we suffer, is self inflicted. We don't have to rely on any of these venues to exercise our lives. I personally believe in the Ten Commandments. I also try and treat everyone that God has made, with respect. I just have to do this. It's all in one's thinking as to how it will all turn out. Remember this, "If God be for us, who can be against us?" - Romans 8:31. Peace and God Bless.

Answer 9

All depends on what any one person may choose to believe or what their perceptions are regarding. The answers to your questions vary as much as each person is different from the next!

In regard to the universe. Human beings at this point know such a minute amount about it, that its nearly un-measurable!!! They don't understand themselves, one another, nature etc etc etc etc..... to infinity!

Human beings are also inherently flawed by design, which means that: If a person chooses to believe in "god" or some other form of supreme being and we're "made in its image", logically that entity is also flawed. Compared to us, indeed may be classified as "perfection", but literally speaking no.

If there is some form of genuine tragedy, it wouldn't be here in this world. You must go directly to the source to find it!!! Most likely being that, the entity responsible for our existence in the first place didn't get it right!

Answer 10

In my opinion the events we perceive as tragic are only fleeting experiences in time and space. They feel and appear tragic to us due to our attachments and closeness to the situations. Viewed from a larger perspectives, these events are happenings but don't alter the grand scheme. Occasionally there may be set-backs in the procession, such as the flooding of Atlantis to clear the slate, but time marches on and progress is not halted. The journey is rarely without twists and turns but the destination always lies ahead somewhere. What we tend to view as tragedies are bumps in the roads which strengthen us, the weary travelers, ever yearning to accomplish the next mission.