Is nationalism a form of racism?

Question

I moved to Wales from England with an open mind to integrate with the Welsh community in which I moved to. However, I have since come to discover that the Welsh are very hostile (particularly in rural Wales) towards English people. I even have English friends who have had bricks thrown through their car windows by Welsh people. These displays of discrimination only make me frustrated and feel resentment towards the Welsh. I now actively support England and make it known any time I can - and especially when the World Cup is on.

Is the type of hostility that Welsh people have towards the English a form of racism or merely just a case of extreme nationalism?

Answer 1

It very much depends on how you define nationalism. If it means just being proud of your country and your roots that's one thing, if it means treating people who come from other countries into your own as second class citizens or making their lives hell simply beause they don't originate from the country they now live in, then yes, it's racism in my view.

Answer 2

Hi,

You have walked into a complicated situation.

Ever heard of Meibion Glyndwr? This was a movement (as opposed to an organisation) that burned down holiday homes in the 80's. Why? The already limited housing stock in rural Wales was becoming too expensive for the local, year round population. Whole villages have been taken over by holiday homes and are consequently very quiet in the winter.

Search for a website called dal dy dir (hold your land) which advocates more peaceful ways of slowing down these demographic changes.

An academic worked out that the effect of English speaking immigrants to Welsh speaking areas in the 80's and 90's was the same as if an additional 200,000 non-English speaking people had moved into a city the size of Leeds - in short, enormous!

In August the National Eisteddfod will be held in Swansea, go and have a look. Welsh culture is a darn site healthier now than when I was a boy, but still feels under threat from these ongoing demographic changes.

In your post you talk a lot about what has been done to you and yours, but I would like you to also think about what sort of effort you have put into your integration efforts and why you moved to Wales in the first place? After all, you should consider rural Wales as a sort of foreign country, as they speak a foreign language, yes?

Do you speak Welsh? If you have children do they? If the answer is no, then sort this out quickly - put the effort in, spend the money, there are lots and lots of ways of getting help.

A view from the other side of the fence, I'm an urban Welsh speaker who has lived in England for more than a decade. I find that English people treat the original language of Britain as a bit of a joke, my name is ridiculed, people go on and on about the funny road signs and generally say things to me that they would never say if I were Asian or Black. So you see, it goes both ways and I agree it is hugely tiresome.

If after all this, you still feel like a fish out of water, move to Cumbria, where they have the same problems with empty houses and city slickers (the councils there want to charge 100% council tax on empty homes).

I have given your question some thought and I think that if you walk into a political situation, then it's neither nationalism nor racism (ask yourself if the ANC were being racist in S. Africa?), it's politics.

Answer 3

The Welsh have genuine historical reasons for hating the English. During the Industrial Revolution Wales was "raped" by England - they built mines to mine out coal to run their mills and factories in England, tried to destroy our language - there was arule in schools that Welsh was not to be spoken, and if a child did they were beaten and made to wear a rope with a large uncomfortable knot in it, known as a Welsh knot. The Anglican Church tried to force Anglicanism on a predominently Presbyterian population - destroying many chapels and English landowners came and enclosed much of the common land and claimed it as their own. When the inhabitants of Wales protested (Rebecca Riots etc), they were savagely and brutally squashed - e.g. the Newport riots in the 1820's where over 100 English troops fired upon a gathering of 50 farmers and their families.

Even during the 1970's many people from England bought property in Wales as holiday homes, pushing house prices up and forcing people out of a community that they had lived in for generations - causing the imfamous fire bombings from the extremist Welsh nationalist group Meibion Glyndwr (Sons of Glendower.

Rural areas suffered most and areas outside of South east Wales (which was most Aglicised) have long memories and are also more likely to embrace their heritage, language, religion as they often regard us Southies as too English.

Nationalism is fine to a certain etc - I love Wales, our language, our culture and despite performances, our Rugby team. That is National Pride. I suppose it is a form a racism, the same as admiring someone of the opposite sex could be classed as sexist! I would happily sit and discuss our national differences with you any time - it's all part of learning about the world about us and understanding other people's perspectives, but when you start having bricks thrown through windows, abuse and assault, that goes beyond national pride and enters the ugly world of racism.

I am sorry to hear of your experiences, and I would like to say that despite the history, the majority of Welsh people have a good relationship with those of you on the wrong side Offa's Dyke. I work with many English people and we often take the p*ss out of each other on a daily basis, but it is always light hearted and I think if both partie are aware that there is no genuine malice intended. (Such as Anne Robinson's comments on the Weakest Link - I was flabbergasted that the story made the press, let alone went as far as a police investiagtion! - why hasn't Matt Lucas been arrested for Dafydd in Little Britain - there must be someone else out there without a sense of humour who finds it deeply offensive, isn't it!!

Answer 4

When will the English learn?
No other nationality likes them (maybe America does)?
English history cannot just be brushed under the table and forgotten, the English history is glorified in the schools!
Kids should be taught the truth not a bunch of propaganda.
I don't think of people hating the English as being racist , if some one hates Baboons, it doesn't mean they hate all animals!
The roads into Wales also lead back out !! Good bye!!

Answer 5

I am so sorry you have had this kind of hostility from the Welsh --- I am Welsh and (apart from the north, mid and south divide) I have observed two different kinds of Welsh ppl ----- those who welcome and embrace new-comers and those who close ranks against them

I am of the former group ------ I lived away for a long time and I would like to remind those of the second kind to remember that the Welsh have emigrated to all parts of the world --------- 'A BETH SYDD YN BOD ARNOCH CHI???' ('So - what is wrong with you?') ------ the elitist Welsh, I mean...

Please don't judge all Welsh people by what has happened to you

I am a 1st language Welsh person and i deplore any kind of prejudice ---- i go out of my way to defuse a situation like this whenever i come across it

Welcome to Wales!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


WOW have just read the other answers ------ I dissociate myself from any form of prejudice!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Answer 6

The Welsh must be displaying racism because Wales is not a nation so how can they be nationalistic?

Answer 7

Nationalism: Devotion to or concern for ones nation.

Racism: A thought or belief that one race is better than another race.

Whereas racism focuses on the inferiority of another race, nationalism focuses on the well being of ones own nation.

No, I don't think nationalism is a form of racism

Answer 8

It can be, especially if the vast majority of a certain nation are of the same race. Example: Nazi Germany before and during the second world war. Proposed that Germany was a superior race, and preached nationalizm.

Answer 9

Hell no but it may contribute by national pride thiking your country is better than another (them being inferior) hence the hostility. I love this country "England till I die!" (It's a song) wouldn't live anywhere else. however i wouldn't put someone down for being proud of their own country. Racists are lacking in many areas like a brain. are we not all human afterall do we not all have the same basic needs and wants?
"For Queen and country"

Answer 10

You're the racist , you and your friends jumped to the conclusion it was Welsh people who bricked their cars without any proof.

From what you say I think it was probably one of your own thick b*stards that did it.

I hate you and I've never met you scumbag.

Did nothing bad ever happen to you in England.

Prat.